The No Goofy Zone Discernment Ministry

The No Goofy Zone is a discernment ministry for saved born again Christians and all who are seeking the truth.We expose non-biblical trends in the church. We are making material available to advance understanding of issue's which endanger Christianity. We believe this constitutes a 'fair use' of any such copyrighted material as provided for in section 107 of the US Copyright Law. In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, the material on this site is distributed without profit.

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Location: Piqua, Ohio, United States

Former drummer for Gary Lewis and The Playboys and The Coasters. Tim has also played with Paul Baloche, Lincoln Brewster, Darlene Zscech and Hillsongs, Jeff Fenholt, SteveCamp among others. Tim founded The Simply Agape Project in 2001 to get free Christian music to the troops. Recordings have been made with Tim, and friends Alex Acuna, Abe Laboriel SR, Justo Almario,Steve Camp , Jared Ming and some wonderful Independant Christian artists.The Somebody Brave CD also features words of encouragment to the soldiers from Pastors, Moms, Dads, and Lt Col Brian Birdwell a Pentegon 9/11 survivor Tim is married to Donna Wirth and has four children Alan 25,Steven 23, Brittany 22, Bethany 21. Tim has played in numerous churchs as well as shows on TBN. Tim has also performed on JCTV on the show Generation Worship featuring worship leader Jared Ming. Tim has a book published worldwide titled "Pass The Plate And Let Us Prey" (My Search For Black and White Christianity in a Gray Nation)

Thursday, July 19, 2007

Checking Under The Hood

As of late people have been upset at me because of my exposure of Rick Warren and James Emery White endorsing the reading of Harry Potter books.
Ive been accused of trying to hurt those who are actively engaging the culture.
But does the Bible teach us that we need to actively engage the culture in order to share Jesus with them?
If you want to know what is counterfeit in the world today do you study what is counterfeit or what is true?
Treasury agents learn to detect counterfeit money not but studying counterfeit bills but actually studying real bills.
Do I need to know everything about Harry Potter or witchcraft to know that it is bad?
No I need to find out what the Bible teaches about witchcraft.

“When you come into the land which the LORD your God is giving you, you shall not learn to follow the abominations of those nations. There shall not be found among you anyone who makes his son or his daughter pass through the fire [an ancient occult practice], or one who practices witchcraft, or a soothsayer, or one who interprets omens, or a sorcerer, or one who conjures spells, or a medium, or a spiritist, or one who calls up the dead. For all who do these things are an abomination [detestable] to the LORD…”
-Deuteronomy 18:9-12a

Now take notice in these verses witchcraft is not linked with a religion but with a practice.
One of the arguments for harry Potter is that it does not promote a religion such as wicca.
Agreed but it does promote practices the Bible strictly forbids.

Some comments from Christian Answers-

Those who follow the path of the magic arts are on the wrong path - a road that leads away from God, not toward Him. In one way or another, the end will be disaster. The evil Queen Jezebel practiced witchcraft (2 Kings 9:22) bringing catastrophe on herself and all Israel. Over and over, God denounces those who "conjure spells" (NKJV) and those who practice witchcraft and sorcery. The Bible says that anyone who does these things is detestable to the Lord (Deuteronomy 18:10-12; 2 Kings 21:6; Micah 5:12; Isaiah 47:12; Ezekiel 13:18, 20; Acts 8:11-24; Leviticus 20:27; Exodus 7:11; Revelation 9:21; 22:15).

God warns of the ultimate punishment. Revelation 21:8 says of "…those who practice magic arts …their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur… the second death" (NIV). Those who practice witchcraft (sorcery) will not inherit the kingdom of God (Galatians 5:20-21). These practices are anti-God and are in rebellion against Him.

The Mars Hill card is also played a lot but Paul called these people ignorant for worshipping a unknown god Acts 17:23.
The same folks defending Harry Potter probably missed this verse in scripture.

Many of citizens of ancient Ephesus practiced the magic arts. Those who became Christians realized the foolish error of their former lives and burned their expensive books of magic as the trash they were.
Acts 19:19
"Also, many of those who had practiced magic brought their books together and burned them in the sight of all. And they counted up the value of them, and it totaled fifty thousand pieces of silver."

And what was the result of these folks burning the books?
Lets look to the next verse.
Acts 19:20
"So the word of the Lord grew mightily and prevailed."

Wow we really dont want to talk about that kind of thing here in America but look at what the results were.

So what do we do about the counterfeit?
Many people who have bought a used car are beware and look to see if a car is cut.
That means a car that has been pieced together to look like a real car but in fact is fake and could cause a big accident possibly killing or severely injuring you.
Many preachers out there today are like cut cars.
Their statement of faith are modeled after the core doctrines of Christianity.
But when you get in and drive around a bit you realize something is wrong.
Compare what they do and preach and teach to Gods Word.
If it doesnt add up shut the door behind you.

Study Gods Word and be faithful Bereans.
Know who Jesus is.
Thats the best way to engage a lost culture and nation.

Men like James Emery White seems to be looking for something good in something that God says is evil.
Be a faithful Berean

Acts 17:11
"These were more fair–minded than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness, and searched the Scriptures daily to find out whether these things were so."


Anonymous Anonymous said...

You missed the point - you don't need to "engage the culture" to share the wonderful news of Jesus Christ. But if you do seek to engage the culture, then learn something about it first!

It's well and good to decry what is wrong, but if you go forward to try to explain to someone what is wrong in depth, then you need to learn what it is you're talking about.

I've personally heard 2 occasions where a well-meaning Christian brother tried to approach a person reading Harry Potter, and I've read many more situations like these where Christians seem to be proud of their own ignorance of a subject while dealing with it. Because of this, the world laughs at Christians, not because of our faith in Christ, but because of our stupidity. "Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me." Not "Blessed are you when ... because of your stupidity."

On one of these times a friend told a lady the books promote witchcraft, but when the person asked how it promoted witchcraft, he said "Well, it has people casting spells and stuff." The lady replied, yes it does, but it doesn't promote spell casting. (it does, but that's what she claimed) My friend went "Oh, really? I didn't realize that," and walked off. The funny part was, he later tried to convince me that Harry Potter was fine because it didn't "promote" witchcraft. I set him straight.

He ruined his own witness, believed falseness, and ruined the witness of other Christians to that lady because of his ignorance.

The second occasion was longer and more complex, but a well-meaning mother and son were made to look like idiots when they tried to talk with a college kid about why the book was wrong. I only overheard the last couple minutes of the "conversation", if it could be called that, but they were made to look like idiots because they didn't know the first thing about Harry Potter. The mom seemed to know her Bible pretty well and essentially said what you've said. The college kid then turned them away in confusion and dismay by portraying the book as condemning the use of magic. The mom and kid left after mumbling "Oh", and "I didn't know that."

I was still there when some of the college kid's friends came back and they had a laugh when he told them about a couple "religious nutjobs" (that's a direct quote) who claimed that Harry Potter was demonic.

Christians sent reeling in confusion while the world laughs.

No one needs to read HP to know it is a book that promotes "magic". It is clearly a book that promotes anti-Biblical ideas, and Christians shouldn't go about reading just to find out how wrong or evil it is.

But! If a Christian expects to convince OTHERS, then he should know what it is he's talking about!

Congratulations for knowing that HP promotes magic and witchcraft. Just don't try to convince anyone else of it because you'll only smear the witness of yourself and others while alienating non-Christians.


3:36 PM  
Blogger Tim Wirth said...

Gage your missing the point and purpose of this blog.
In our title it states
"The No Goofy Zone is a discernment ministry exposing non-biblical trends in the church. We are making material available to advance understanding of issue's which endanger Christianity."
This is a blog to inform saved Christians of current culture and other events that ar impacting Christianity.
Most unbelievers would not know where Im coming from and could care less what the Bible teaches about a topic.
But thanks for showing that arrogance sometimes replaces slight ignorance.
When ingaging the culture or witnessing to someone I share Christ I dont even bring up Harry Potter and i certainly dont come off with the attitude of "You'll go to hell for reading Harry Potter."
I keep the focus on Christ nothing else.
Whether Im talking to a wiccan or, drug addict, or whoever I keep the focus on Jesus who loves them and died on the cross for them.
Cleaning them up is the job of the Holy Spirit (not me) Who once they are saved will put them through the process of santification and conviction of sin.
The Holy Spirit aids them in shedding the old man and putting on the new man.
I certainly am not qualified to clean anyone else up.
I have enough of a job cleaning up my own act and trying to be a strong witness to my wife, kids and those God puts in my path.
Again this blog is to inform Christians about current events not the unsaved who dont have the Holy Spirit to discern scripture for them or lead them into all truth.
I will adjust my title to help others understand where Im coming from.
Sorry you were confused.
I hope you finish well.

6:56 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Good for you Tim, you don't deal with Harry Potter while witnessing and that's a good thing, but not everyone is like you in that they don't have times where HP comes up.

Rick Warren and James White, while they have quite a few of their own problems, are dealing with people who ARE talking about HP. They aren't alone. HP is a topic that comes up quite often in church and non-church circles, and anyone who has conversations about it should be able to discuss it intelligibly.

It's fine for you to say that you don't need to read HP because you don't have to talk about it.

It's not fine to say no Christian should ever read HP, or to bash Warren and White who, in this instance, are dealing with Christians who interact with others about HP. It may be a rarity, but in this case Warren is right in saying HP is a book series Christians should study if they want/need to deal with people who have read them.

10:23 AM  
Blogger Tim Wirth said...

Again people are really missing the point here. Harry Potter is being read by many Christians not as a research tool but as entertainment comparing the work to CS Lewis and Tolkein.
This is really not a complex cultural issue.
Even if Harry Potter is being bought up by a unbeliever when you witness to them we dont need to know anything about Harry Potter but who Jesus is.
This article is to warn Christians who think its ok to read Harry Potter.
Sorry for some reason Im not clear on that.
Christians dont need it for relatability when witnessing because it is a non issue.
For Christians that are trying to find good in this book well they need to refer to scripture and what it states about witchcraft and learning witchcraft.
The Bible address's the practice of witchcraft very clearly.
Now for those who would say that Harry Potter does not teach witchcraft as religion (I agree) the Bible is very clear about the PRACTICE of witchcraft which Harry Potter clearly teaches.
And for goodness sake this is not a good book for any child to read.

Read this quote again from James Emery White
"First, to think the books are evil and wrong and harmful – in and of themselves – is misguided. As Christian author Charles Colson, along with other Christian writers and thinkers such as Richard Mouw, Connie Neal, Alan Jacobs and Francis Bridger have noted, the magic used in the books is mechanical, not blatantly occultic. No more than the magical powers of Superman. It’s attempting to be fantasy, not reality. There is no contact with a supernatural, demonic world in the classical form of the occult. " end quote

Read that last sentence again. Are you kidding me?

Here is another quote from James Emery White.

"In truth, they are simply morality tales, and the magic is used as a metaphor for power. The overarching theme is the fight between good and evil, and that evil is real, and must be resisted. Rowling herself is a professing Christian and member of the Church of Scotland, and while she doesn’t pretend the Harry Potter series are overtly Christian books, a Christian worldview is behind every page." end quote/
Read that last sentence agin folks.
And after that James goes on to promote Harry Potter to children of of course with mum and dad looking on.( and if mum and dad allow this reading they are the ones who need the help)

A Christian worldview behind every page?

Maybe this is Rick Warren and James Emery Whites Christian worldview.

But its certainly not the Christian worldview of the Bible.
Im sorry I dont mean to sound condencending but if you dont get this you probably are deceived into theis new form (false form) of Christianity taking shape.

It doesnt matter if someone is a satanist and has read the satanic bible.
I dont need to know what the satanic bible says to share Jesus Christ with someone.

Rick and James are trying to justify the reading of Harry Potter books not to be culturally relative because you dont need to know about the culture to share Christ with someone.
The Holy Spirit draws and leads the person anyway.
Rick Warren for one has written the Holy Spirit out of the equation and teaches man made ways which draws a crowd but saves no one.
You do need to know who Jesus is.
And the Jesus of the Bible condems witchcraft in any form or practice.

7:06 PM  
Blogger Tim Wirth said...

One more thing.
I just wish people would say "I just want to read Harry Potter because I want to."
Thats the real issure here.
The Bible states that

"For rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry. Because thou hast rejected the word of the LORD, he hath also rejected thee from being king.
1 Samuel 15:23
That sums it all up.
Witchcraft is noted as sin.
And it also speaks of rebellion and a rejection of the word of the Lord.
That is the state of the New Christianity being promoted by folks like Rick Warren and James Emery White.

7:13 PM  
Blogger Dave Norris said...

The trouble with Harry Potter supporters is that, as believers, they have not distinguished between the holy and the unholy (Ezekiel 22:26) and believers should not be endorsing anything that smacks of witchcraft. Sorcerers, and I believe Harry Potter is known as one, "Shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone"- Revelation 21:8, which should be enough for any true believer.

8:18 PM  

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