The No Goofy Zone Discernment Ministry

The No Goofy Zone is a discernment ministry for saved born again Christians and all who are seeking the truth.We expose non-biblical trends in the church. We are making material available to advance understanding of issue's which endanger Christianity. We believe this constitutes a 'fair use' of any such copyrighted material as provided for in section 107 of the US Copyright Law. In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, the material on this site is distributed without profit.

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Former drummer for Gary Lewis and The Playboys and The Coasters. Tim has also played with Paul Baloche, Lincoln Brewster, Darlene Zscech and Hillsongs, Jeff Fenholt, SteveCamp among others. Tim founded The Simply Agape Project in 2001 to get free Christian music to the troops. Recordings have been made with Tim, and friends Alex Acuna, Abe Laboriel SR, Justo Almario,Steve Camp , Jared Ming and some wonderful Independant Christian artists.The Somebody Brave CD also features words of encouragment to the soldiers from Pastors, Moms, Dads, and Lt Col Brian Birdwell a Pentegon 9/11 survivor Tim is married to Donna Wirth and has four children Alan 25,Steven 23, Brittany 22, Bethany 21. Tim has played in numerous churchs as well as shows on TBN. Tim has also performed on JCTV on the show Generation Worship featuring worship leader Jared Ming. Tim has a book published worldwide titled "Pass The Plate And Let Us Prey" (My Search For Black and White Christianity in a Gray Nation)

Friday, April 11, 2008

The Mythical World of Richard Abanes Part 3-The Final Chapter?



In deciding whether or not to write about Richard Abanes and the spin he uses to mislead the Body of Christ you need to balance certain things.

In my many dealings with Abanes he seems to thrive on attention negative or positive.

As long as someone is talking about him that seems to feed Richards narcissistic personality and being.
So do we keep feeding or do we move on to another topic?

Well after this article and another update from Bud Press on Abanes and Ken Blanchard we will be moving on.

Im not in the business of giving Abanes so much press but to show his error.

It is my hope that this series of article will show the truth in all this, not according to Tim but show that what Richard Abanes is doing is unscriptural.

Will I convince any of Richards fans?
Probably not but all this time is worth it if we can convince that audience of one who is not sure what to make out of all this.

Richards latest drive by commenting seems to focus on Calvary Chapel churches as well as Richards new friends in the Emergent Church.
This does not surprise me because of this point.

source -http://www.lighthousetrailsresearch.com/recall.htm

June 16, 2006 - Costa Mesa, CA: Last week at Calvary Chapel's annual pastor's conference, founder and Senior Pastor Chuck Smith announced that Calvary Chapel was rejecting various movements and practices that have been taking place within the Christian church at large as well as in some Calvary Chapel churches. According to a number of pastors who spoke with Lighthouse Trails this week, Smith asked that those Calvary Chapel pastors who were going in the direction of the emerging church would no longer call themselves Calvary Chapel churches.

This week a notice was placed on the Calvary Chapel Distribution website recalling Chuck Smith Sr's book, When Storms Come (which had been tampered with). The notice also stated: "The teaching and positions of Rick Warren have come into conflict with us at Calvary Chapel. Pastor Chuck has directed us to discontinue this product effective immediately."
Both Purpose Driven and the emerging church promote contemplative spirituality, which is a belief system that is contrary to biblical Christianity. Popular authors such as Richard Foster, Brian McLaren, Rick Warren, Henri Nouwen, Brennan Manning and many others teach contemplative spirituality (also known as spiritual formation).
Now I need to note here that Richard thinks most everyone that disagrees with him falls here.
Abanes own words from his latest blog post-
RA-"What I see happening now is the rise of so-called ‘discerners” who have three strikes against them. And if I may be blunt here, please forgive me, but it is what I have witnessed first hand: 1) They have no calling that I can see based on their errors and attitudes; 2) they don’t have the intellectual capacity to handle the complex issues they are tackling; and 3) they are not filled to any measure with God’s love, tenderness, or love for truth." end of comment

Richard so often us accuses all of us discerners with meanness, hate speech, lack of love etc..
This is a very common ploy and is also used (sometimes with great affect) with the homosexual lobby in a attempt to quench Gods Word and a Christian voice in this darkness.
Look at whats going on north of the border to us in Canada.

For the record again I am not out to get Richard Abanes, Rick Warren,Ken Blanchard etc..
I am in the business of getting out the truth and asking you to look carefully at whats going on in Christianity today.
The ultimate conclusion is your's and should always be based on scripture and the Holy Spirit leading you into all truth.
Richard Abanes only tells half truth's (which are really no truth at all) and never answers the hard questions that he cannot spin in his favor.
This is well know by many of us who have labour sly watch Abanes spin his web across the internet.
Can you see the double mindedness of Richard Abanes in his posts.

Abanes has stated many times that he is not a spokesperson for Rick Warren but yet in a blog he starts out his comment like this

"In reality, what Warren is saying is that.."

Not that I have to convince most of you who read this blog but check out this exchange from a blog last month.
Richard Abanes states-
"Guys, guys, guys, guys…

Ok, hear me out. Take note of Apologetic Lesson One: Never look at one of anything to build an opinion. Not one word. Not one statement. Not one deed.

To ignore this primary lesson in apologetics is to basically commit an error similar to the type of error you would commit by taking one Bible verse out of context. This is especially true, when seeing something that appears to be an anomaly. In srcipture we can see this in all the verses wherein God is spoken of as one. But then suddenly, WHAMO!, the New Tstament, and we see Jesus being called God. Say Waaaaahh??? Both JW and LDS jump to a conclusion — i.e., Jesus is another God. How wrong is that? Basically, they ignore many other verses and do not think it through to try and see compatibility.

Now, let us take this issue of Warren. We have a very interesting incident that on the surface MIGHT suggest pluralism (if that’s what you’re looking for). Either that, or it is Warren’s endorsement of Judaism (if that’s what you’rel ooking for). Only problem is: these views would be inconsistent, indeed it would contradict, what he has stated both before and afterward. Hmm.
(And then goes on to say)
So, whatever Warren was doing or saying or attempting at the Jewish gathering, it must fit into the paradigm established by such words/teachings/views, as well as his own ongoing preaching about the Cross, Sin, Hell, Christ, and repentance (see my article “Saddleback: The Cross, Sin, and Hell” at
you can read the entire exchange here
http://phoenixpreacher.com/cms/?p=2531"

Can you see the logic here?
Of course not because there is none..
Folks this is not a rational or biblical thought process here on the part of Richard Abanes.
But of course Richard can call himself an apologist.
Even though by definition,fact and sheer time spent on the internet Richard defends Rick Warrens faith more than the Christian faith in which I believe Richard has become a pro at distorting.
Richard has stated for the record that Ken Blanchard is no new ager even though after posting a 2008 update which stated Blanchard is doing fine Richard was forced to put up a update on Ken Blanchard that warns of Kens teachings and books.
Now look at this closely one the same page we find that Ken Blanchard is fine and no new ager and on the same page a warning about Ken Blanchards books, endorsements etc..
Is this rational thought folks?
I will let you decide.
Richard Abanes also states Leonard Sweet is no new ager.
You cannot read Len Sweets free ebook "Quantum Spiritality" and not discern from Sweets own words that he is a new ager who wraps himself in a form of Christianese.
Is Richard using rational thought here you decide.

"Second, as for Strobel aligning himself with Schuller? Strobel has never aligned himself with Robert Schuller. Strobel simply appeared at a conference of international leaders (Christian and non-Christian) that was held at the Crystal Cathedral" end of quote
My comments- how do you show up at Schullers church and not align yourself with Schuller he is the pastor here?
And how about these thoughts from Richard
"Was Kay's appearance at Robert Schuller's Crystal Cathedral some kind of endorsement of Schuller that erased all of the remarks Rick Warren has made about how he strongly disagrees with Schuller in many areas (see "Warren and Schuller: Debunking an Urban Legend")? No, it was not."

Folks this is spin and really bad spin at that.
You cant separate a pastor and what he represents from the church he founded.
This is really poor defence on the part of Abanes.

One more parting blog comment from Richard Abanes-

"It is all very insidious, sinful, and destructive. And thanks to the Internet, there is no accountability. It’s been terribly painful to watch the noble calling of apologetics be driven into the ground like this. Walter Martin must be rolling over back and forth in his grave. I wish he were here today. (The “discerners” would probably call him a compromising heretic if he didn’t take their views - LoL)."
end of comment

Compare Richards comment with this-

Q - THE CHRISTIAN SENTINEL: Why was Richard Abanes' Word Faith appendix dropped from the new Kingdom of the Cults?
A - JILL MARTIN RISCHE AND KEVIN RISCHE: The 1997 edition of The Kingdom of the Cults was done without the direct involvement of the Martin family. For the 2003 edition, Darlene Martin and Bethany House Publishers designated Kevin Rische and Jill Martin Rische as the Managing Editors, and the Risches, in agreement with several members of the Martin family, made the decision to remove the Word of Faith Appendix. We did not believe that Walter Martin would have included this Appendix in the 1997 edition, had he edited it. In addition, even if the subject had been appropriate for Kingdom of the Cults, this appendix incorporated very little of Walter Martin’s material on the subject. Wherever possible, Walter Martin’s material should be the primary source and in this case, it was not.

Mr. Abanes has stated publicly that members of the Martin family were pressured by the Word of Faith movement to drop this appendix. This was never the case. He also implied publicly that Jill Martin Rische was in sympathy with Word of Faith because her degree is from Oral Roberts University. This is completely false.

Q - THE CHRISTIAN SENTINEL: Was the fact that he [Richard Abanes] allegedly plagiarized Van Gorden from the Kingdom of the Cults a consideration in your decision?

A - JILL MARTIN RISCHE AND KEVIN RISCHE: Yes.

Q - THE CHRISTIAN SENTINEL: Were you concerned about Abanes' accuracy and research conclusions with his work in the KoC?

A - JILL MARTIN RISCHE AND KEVIN RISCHE: Yes.




So lets just stop there I could show example after example of Richards parting from the real world and biblical Christianity but now you need to decide for yourselves.
I must say its really scary that Richard seems to be busy on a book about the new age.
A book that Richard is not qualified to write because of his apparent lack of knowledge and discernment about the topic of new age religion.
But then again these days when do you need knowledge or discernment to get a deal from a Christian publisher these days.
Often you just need a big backer.
And Im sure Richard has that.
Peace
And remember to search the scriptures to see if what I say is true.
Tim Wirth


sources
http://abanes.com/warren_blanchard.html
http://simplyagape.blogspot.com/2005/08/richard-abanes-defends-leonard-sweet.html
http://abanes.com/Kay_Schuller.html
http://abanes.com/myarticles.html
http://abanes.com/warrensmith.html
http://www.cultlink.com/sentinel/rische-abanes.htm
http://phoenixpreacher.com/cms/?p=2531
http://simplemindedpreacher.wordpress.com/2008/04/01/the-right-to-choose/#comment-23259

3 Comments:

Anonymous J Mark said...

Thanks for responding truthfully to what Richard Abanes perceives to be his ministry. Abanes continually and constantly misrepresents and attacks legitimate ministries. We can all pray that he might see and love truth and the Word of God as it is and not through the lens of Rick Warren.

5:08 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

http://www.sliceoflaodicea.com/?p=641

Look at this article

3:55 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

http://www.sliceoflaodicea.com/?p=641

3:56 PM  

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