The No Goofy Zone Discernment Ministry

The No Goofy Zone is a discernment ministry for saved born again Christians and all who are seeking the truth.We expose non-biblical trends in the church. We are making material available to advance understanding of issue's which endanger Christianity. We believe this constitutes a 'fair use' of any such copyrighted material as provided for in section 107 of the US Copyright Law. In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, the material on this site is distributed without profit.

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Location: Piqua, Ohio, United States

Former drummer for Gary Lewis and The Playboys and The Coasters. Tim has also played with Paul Baloche, Lincoln Brewster, Darlene Zscech and Hillsongs, Jeff Fenholt, SteveCamp among others. Tim founded The Simply Agape Project in 2001 to get free Christian music to the troops. Recordings have been made with Tim, and friends Alex Acuna, Abe Laboriel SR, Justo Almario,Steve Camp , Jared Ming and some wonderful Independant Christian artists.The Somebody Brave CD also features words of encouragment to the soldiers from Pastors, Moms, Dads, and Lt Col Brian Birdwell a Pentegon 9/11 survivor Tim is married to Donna Wirth and has four children Alan 25,Steven 23, Brittany 22, Bethany 21. Tim has played in numerous churchs as well as shows on TBN. Tim has also performed on JCTV on the show Generation Worship featuring worship leader Jared Ming. Tim has a book published worldwide titled "Pass The Plate And Let Us Prey" (My Search For Black and White Christianity in a Gray Nation)

Sunday, July 27, 2008

The Abanes Spin Zone

Its news by now that Saddleback member and apoligist Richard Abanes has had Pastor Ken Silva'a website shut down with legal threats to Ken's ISP I Power. The thing is Abanes has not yet stated what specifically Ken stated in the 3 year old article what was slander and libel. I read the article and saw no such thing there.
Here is more on Richard Abanes and his form of spin.

Sunday, July 20, 2008

Attacking Men Of God By Bud Press

With all of the “attack” accusations flying around, I thought I would post the below article I wrote a few years ago. Hopefully, it will demonstrate that the same accusations are used by the dedicated followers of false prophets and false teachers–in particular the cults and the hyper-heretical Word-Faith Movement.

Attacking Men Of God?

As one who has been involved in an apologetics ministry for years, it sickens me, and I’m sure my colleagues, to be accused of “attacking” the most dangerous and prolific false prophets and false teachers of our day, especially when clear-cut, easy-to-comprehend documentation is provided.


“Why are you attacking an anointed man of God?!” they ask.

“I’m warning you! Stop attacking this prophet of God!” they warn.

“Who are you to attack the anointed? If he is wrong then God will deal with him, not you!” they ramble.

“Heresy hunter! Heresy hunter! You are on dangerous ground for attacking a child of God!” they yell.

“I’ve never heard him say that. You’re just making that up. You will suffer for your attacks on the servants of the Lord!” they threaten.

And on, and on, and on. Their carbon-copy cries are as a broken record, with nothing more to offer than accusations.

With all of the “attacking” going on, one would think the one exposing the deception had led a hoard of savage Vikings into a church or a crusade to successfully pillage, plunder and vandalize the works of God.

Please, give us a break. Cut us some slack. Chill-out and think.

The Christian gains discernment by studying God’s word. Christians make God’s word their final authority. Do your homework. Read and listen to the evidence, then compare the evidence with the final authority.

When you realize you have followed a false teacher–and have been conditioned to lash-out at those who share the truth in love–swallow your pride and join the battle against deception.

“The wicked man flees though no one pursues, but the righteous are as bold as a lion” (Proverbs 28:1).

In Christ,
Bud Press
(Jude 3)

Bud Press On Truth and Richard Abanes

Dear Tim:

This post is for the benefit of your readers who are interested in truth. Although this post does not reveal the entire story, it may very well develop into an informative article in the future.

There are truths and there are lies, and it is up to us to discern the difference between the two. When faced with truth we have a choice: deny it, compromise, and make excuses, or accept it–regardless of personal agendas, personal feelings, or personal ties.

Indeed, solid, irrefutable documentation stands on its own and cannot be denied. Documentation displaces ad hominem, innuendo, and off-the-cuff statements. It also provides people with the other side of the story and allows them to “test” and think on their own, as opposed to accepting someone’s word.

People deserve truth at all times, even if it hurts, for it is truth that sets people free.

This year, I spent a considerable amount of time carefully reviewing and preserving the articles on Richard Abanes’ website, specifically those that dealt with Ken Blanchard and his involvement with and participation in the New Age Movement. I have also monitored and preserved Abanes’ movements on numerous internet blogs and elsewhere.

Later, I felt led to contact Abanes and provide information on Ken Blanchard that he may not have been aware of. Despite his treatment of myself and others, and despite Ken Blanchard’s strong ties with Rick Warren, I gave Abanes the benefit of the doubt and reached out to him in love.

During an exchange of e-mails, Abanes requested updated information on Ken Blanchard, to which I gladly provided. On numerous occasions, Abanes gave his word to issue a public statement on Ken Blanchard, and even went so far to say he would privately inform his pastor, Rick Warren.

But as of this writing, Richard Abanes has not kept his word, and has even gone so far as to help me with the following “tantalizing conspiratorial scenario” on Ken Blanchard:

“Ken Blanchard, who is really my Uncle Kenny, called and pleaded with me to not expose his true New Age agenda, which is to teach the church how to Lead Like A New Age Jesus. And to bribe me, he deposited $30 million into a Swiss Bank account with the last 3 numbers being 666. I told him that this would be acceptable, and that I’d never say anything negative about his book endorsements or associations with new Agers as long as I not only got the cash, but also was promoted to the Regional Director of the Illuminati, complete with my own special ‘I’ embroidered blazer, a coat of arms pin, and a direct special hot phone line to the Vatican” (CRN.Info blog, June 6, 2008 at 10:32am, ).

This is disturbing. Equally disturbing is that in the same post Abanes accused me of harassment, and stated in part that:

“I told you that I’d get to Ken Blanchard and make my report when possible, given my responsibilities. I’ve already begun the research, and have even posted a caution about him to persons visiting my website.”

But again, as of this writing, Richard Abanes has not kept his word. And, because of the strong ties between Ken Blanchard and Rick Warren, I will be surprised if Abanes keeps his word on this issue at all.

My first letter to Richard Abanes was on March 11, 2008–over 4 months ago! During our exchange of e-mails I granted Abanes permission to link to my articles on Ken Blanchard and post my e-mails on his website. I have nothing to hide, and would like to see Abanes post ALL of our correspondence on his website and blogs, in their entirety, for the world to see.

Richard Abanes reached out to me and asked for updates on Ken Blanchard. But behind-the-scenes, he reached out to his constituency with something entirely different.

For example, one of Richard Abanes’ excuses for not dealing with the Ken Blanchard issue was the responsibilities with his new book. But since my first letter to him on March 11, those responsibilities didn’t stop Abanes from spending an incredible amount of time posting lengthy messages in various blogs and dealing with New Agers on “YouTube.” Many of his blog posts had nothing to do with his new book.

I knew exactly when Abanes’ part in the book was finished. I talked to his editor.

Speaking of blog posts, in the Phoenix Preacher blog on April 17, 2008, a poster named “Dusty” asked the question, “Anyone heard of Christian Research Service?” Yet, despite the fact that Abanes had requested updates from me on Ken Blanchard, he stated to Dusty with the following:

Richard Abanes
April 17th, 2008 at 8:22 pm
Dusty: Anyone heard of Christian Research Service?
RA: Yes. Bad. False. Slander. Sensationalistic. Knee-jerk. A guy named Bud Press. I am pretty much a heretic, iar, and compromiser to them.
[ ]

One minute later in the same blog, Abanes stated:

Richard Abanes
April 17th, 2008 at 8:23 pm
I’ve tried to take civilly with Bud Press, but he will have none of it. He is one of the people whose thoughts about me are echoed in the above list I posted of accusations that have ben made against me this year. [Ibid.]

Again, in the same blog at 8;27 pm, Richard Abanes stated:

“ROFL. Yeah, it’s called truth. Oh, and I actually get along very very well with the REAL discernment folk out there. Lots of very good ministries that have nothing to do with these Bud Press types.”

On April 29, 2008, Richard Abanes wrote me a “DO NOT CONTACT ME AGAIN” e-mail, then turned around on May 10 and requested additional information on Ken Blanchard and asked me to “Please send it again.”

Needless to say, all Abanes had to do was go to the “Ken Blanchard/Lead Like Jesus?” page of my website and find the information I had provided to him in the first place.

But here we are now, Tim, months later, and Abanes is still ranting and raving about all the “lies/slander” being spread about him. Sadly, he is too spiritually blinded to see that he is his own worst enemy. It is he who has destroyed his reputation and integrity, and it is we who have nothing to fear from him or others like him.

With dedicated vengeance, Richard Abanes has waged a battle and attempted to destroy many solid, Bible-based ministries. But he is fighting a loosing battle.

Many of those I have spoken to within the apologetics and cult-evangelism communities have had their own encounters with Richard Abanes. They all maintain, as I, that there is no reasoning with him and that he has damaged his reputation and integrity on his own.

Unless Abanes fully repents and reconciles, he is on his way to self-destruction and judgement from God.

“When a wise man has a controversy with a foolish man, the foolish man either rages or laughs, and there is no rest” (Proverbs 29:9)

So I say to Richard Abanes and those like him, keep Rolling On the Floor Laughing (ROFL); keep mocking ministries called of God to share the truth and defend the faith; keep twisting the truth and causing the innocent to stumble. After all the dust has settled, God will have the last word.

“The one who guards his mouth preserves his life; the one who opens wide his lips comes to ruin” (Proverbs 13:3).

“At the same time they also learn to be idle, as they go around from house to house; and not merely idle, but also gossips and busybodies, talking about things not proper to mention” (1 Timothy 5:13).

“Now I urge you, brethren, keep your eye on those who cause dissensions and hindrances contrary to the teaching which you learned, and turn away from them. For such men are slaves, not of our Lord Christ but of their own appetites; and by their smooth and flattering speech they deceive the hearts of the unsuspecting” (Romans 16:17-18).

God bless you, Tim. Stay strong in the Lord.

Bud Press, Director
Christian Research Service
Jude 3

Related reading:

Letters to Richard Abanes…

Richard Abanes Issues Warning About Ken Blanchard…

Ken Blanchard/Lead Like Jesus? Research Page

Monday, July 14, 2008

Two Different Camps And Spiritual Blindness

John 9:39-41

"39 And Jesus said, “For judgment I have come into this world, that those who do not see may see, and that those who see may be made blind.”
40 Then some of the Pharisees who were with Him heard these words, and said to Him, “Are we blind also?”
41 Jesus said to them, “If you were blind, you would have no sin; but now you say, ‘We see.’ Therefore your sin remains.

First I want to start this article off with some comments from men who are much more learned that myself.

"Religious leaders are often amongst those who are spiritually blind. Many times Jesus accused the Pharisees of being “blind leaders of the blind” (Matthew 15:14; 23:24; 23:26 etc.). Thus being religious, a christian or even a christian leader does not provide immunity from this ailment. It is even possible that religious people are more prone to catching this than other people and the more spiritual we think we are, the more likely we are to catch it.

There are a few things that cause blindness. The first is pride. Remember that “All the ways of a man are pure in his own eyes” (Proverbs 16:2). After Saul had disobeyed the command of the Lord, he actually erected a statue to himself, and with the bleating of the cursed sheep in the background, greeted Samuel with the words: “I have performed the commandment of the LORD” (1Samuel 15:13). His arrogance had made him so blind that he really thought that wrong was right. Even after Samuel had clearly explained to Saul how he had disobeyed, he still did not get it. The story of the first king of Israel is a sad saga of a man who was so blinded by his arrogance that he never understood a single thing the prophet said to him. Even once David had been anointed in his place and clearly carried God’s blessing, Saul still thought he could hold onto the anointing by killing David. How terribly sad.

The antidote to blindness that comes through pride is obviously humility.

source Anton Bosch

"So, the world is divided into two groups: those that are in darkness, the spiritually blind and those that have sight, the spiritually seeing. There are only two kinds of people. There's no half sight. There are no partially blind. You either see or you are totally blind. "

If a man won't recognize his blindness, Christ can't give him sight, is that right? And that was the Pharisees problem. They would not admit their blindness. Jesus says I came to give sight to those who know they need it and I came to those who think they see to let them know they're really blind and if need be to confirm them in their blindness.

When Jesus sees this man worshiping at His feet and He compares the humble confiding heart of that beggar with the hostility and stubborn hatred of the Pharisees, He admits that that's the way it's going to be when He comes. When I come, there's going to be judgment...slash, right down the middle, this group will believe and see, this group will be obstinate and will not see and will be confirmed in their blindness."

source John MacArthur

So what does Phoenix Preacher, Sliced Laodecia (CRN.Info) and their buddy Richard Abanes all have in common?

Let me preface this first by stating that I do not think everyone who frequents either one of these blogs are spiritually blind. I do however think the leadership at both these blogs fit this category.

And I also want you no notice that this opposite camp would also state the same about myself and my brothers and sisters in the Lord.

I will leave it to you the reader to decide who is spiritially blind.

What prompted me to write this article was a comment that the leader of Phoenix Preacher left on my blog (a comment I have not posted until now) as well as a lot thats been going on this last year with people like Richard Abanes and the sites he frequents.

Here is Michael's comment's

"Two differences…
I allow dissenting viewpoints on my blog and I’m accountable for what I say.
Bud Press was allowed to voice his opinions, as ill thought out as they were.
The other major difference is that people actually read my blog."

This reply was on a article I wrote here-

The biggest problem I have with members of the opposite camp is that there comments are very often not mature and do not even address the topic being discussed. If you have a dissenting view thats fine but explain why, and then explain your position. Dont just do a drive by comment. Whats the point thats not edyifying at all to the Body of Christ. If Im wrong, well ok , show me where Im wrong or in error with what scripture teaches.

Lets look at Michaels comments-

" I allow dissenting viewpoints on my blog'

To Michaels point I do as well if it adds to the discussion. I would also ask Michael in a act of fairness hold Abanes and his blog under the same scrutiny as you do me. I often do not let comments fly here because of several reasons.

1. The comment sometimes does not address the topic being spoke of. Look at the long strings of comments often made by 5-10 people on both Phoenix Preacher or CRN. Go down to about the middle of the comments and look at whats being stated. They can either be talking about hockey or some other bunny trail. Usually nothing to do with the post. It turns into a old ladies quilting bee gossip session often found in small towns. Whats the point of letting comment's like that go on? Im not letting that happen here. If you disagree with me thats ok I dont know everything. But say why you disagree and show scripture that backs up what you state. The bottom line with either camp is that nothing we say matters if it doesntjive with Gods word in scripture. The real scary thing is that many of these comments are made by men who state they are pastors. Michaels recent comments to me were made at around 5:30 am this morning. Michael looking at my site that early now that is weird.

I want to add that often these long strings that sites like Phoenix Preacher and CRN generate produce a lot of hits but reduce down to gossip, innuendo and ad hominem attack.

Michaels comments-

"I’m accountable for what I say"

My comments-Thats great what was the responce from those you are accountable to you telling my brother in the Lord Bud Press to "bleep off"?

The other camp also implies often that myself and my brothers and sisters in the Lord are not accountable to anyone.

I cant speak for everyone but I can state we do hold each other accountable. And as for me I attend a church on a regular basis and am accountable to a pastor who knows about and reads my blog. A pastor who I let know "If you ever see anything on my site that concerns you please let me know". My pastor does read my blog and has invited Ray Yungen author of "Time of Departing" to speak at our church at the end of this month.

Michaels comments-

"Bud Press was allowed to voice his opinions, as ill thought out as they were."

My comments-

Notice Michael does not extend grace to Bud Press by perhaps saying Bud Press was allowed to voice his opinion's, I however disagree with them (and then state why he disagree's with Buds opinions).

Instead Michael chooses to use a ad hominem attack. Something me and my brothers and sisters in the Lord are accused of all the time. Even though the choose of words very seldom are backed up with a statement and facts on why someone thinks we are using ad hominem.

And now to the facts behind Buds statement on Phoenix Preacher. Bud was just holding Richard Abanes accountable. Richard emailed Bud and asked Bud for more information on Ken Blanchard and Ken's new age connection. Richard wanted new information that took place after 2005. Bud provided the information which Richard Abanes has choosen not to act on.

Why were Buds comments thought of as opinions? They were not based on any opnions what so ever but factual information? And Bud responded with grace. Or did I miss something here?

Michaels recent comments-

"There is no such thing as an Arminianist, but that’s par for the course with you."

My comments- Michael does not state his position on why there is no such thing as a Arminianist just points out Im wrong and then adds ad hominem.

Simpson proves that he understands neither Arminianism or Calvinism as he mangles both systems badly.

My comments-does not explain where he thinks Sandy was in error. Just a drive by comment with no thought because Michael does not state his opposing position.

You really need to take some classes…"

My comments ad hominem and trying to be spiritually elite something I have had to deal with when I played in Word faith churches. Same spirit as Abanes has and its not the Holy Spirit. We are dealing with a spirit here folks. The camp I am in would state that the opposite camp is in spiritual blindness. The opposite camp would state the same thing about us. You decide who is biblically correct.

Michael has addressed the Todd Bentley issue over at his blog. Good for him.

Richard Abanes has remained silent about Todd Bentley and what he thinks about Todd and this false revival. C.Peter Wagner is connected to both Todd and Rick Warren. Plus it would alientatea target book buying audience. Perhaps thatswhy Richard remains silent about Ken Blanchard as well. Abanes deals mainly with what is outside of Christianity not deception from within. Again dealing with whats going on within would alienate ones target audience when you are selling a product.

Im amazed by folks who flock to Abanes and cant see through Richard and his spin.

Look at the Rick Warren, Robert Schuller connection.

In Richards booklet "Rick Warren and the Purpose that Drives Him". Richard had a golden opportunity to set the record straight about Warren and Schuller.

Missed it because he did not let Rick Warren speak for himself.

Richard asked Rick Warren this on page 29

RA: And (Robert) Schuller is your mentor!

RW: And Schuller is my mentor!

RA: Ok,wait. Is Robert Schuller your mentor?

RW: No! Never has been, never would be!

End of quote-

Wow thats it. A really big issue and in a personal interview with Rick Warren two small quotes dedicated to this hot topic. But wait Richard dedicates pages 99-106 explaining to his audience on how Rick thinks and feels about this issue. But yet we didnt hear this from Warren himself when he was given the opportunity to clear this up.

Looking at Warrens methods and the Warrens continued alliance with Schullers conferences any discerning Christian can see the real deal here.

This is just one instance in many where Richard Abanes tells us how Rick Warren thinks and feels.

You decide whats truth.

I am opposed to all Rick Warren does because his root is evil. He built his business(Saddleback and Purpose Driven religion) on the whims of what the unsaved wanted in a church. This is history by what Rick Warren did. This method is also diametrically opposed to what scripture teaches in building a church. Check the book of Acts on how a church is supposed to be built.

I want to state that I do not hate Rick Warren, Abanes or any of the folks at CRN or Phoenix preacher or anyone for that matter. Online is often a difficult media form to communicate your heart from because people cannot hear the tone of your voice or other nuances that make vocal communication a better way to communicate.

Now granted letting Richard Abanes comment on your blog almost guarantee's you a couple hundred hits to your blog (usually by about the same 10-15 people).

But is this all edifying to the Body of Christ?

I tell you what Christianity is a mess here in the states. And maybe a part of that problem is because many shepherds are spending more time online than they are with their flocks.

Ultimately you decide.

I will allow opposing views on this post if you so desire. Stay on topic though or your post will not see the light of day. If Im in error show me where and prove your point. I dont care how long your comments are as long as they stay on topic. Thats the rules you will need to abide by them.

Plus I work so if your post is not immediately on dont think I am censoring you, I just may not have read your comment yet. I will not allow comments that

I spend a very limited time online.

If you dont want to comment and take this to your own blogs thats fine of course.

I take your opposition and negative article's about me as a badge of honor.

Because we are from two different camps.



Sunday, July 13, 2008

I have never considered myself either a Calvinist (soft or 3 point or whatever term people would use) or Aminianist but just a Christian a follower of Jesus Christ.

I have friends that are Calvinist who of course I still consider friends and brothers and sisters in the Lord.

This is a older article by my good friend and brother in the Lord Sandy Simpson and is a very good read.

Sandy Simpson has been a reliable source of biblically solid information information for me for many years. The materials that he promotes on his website are very well worth the small cost they are sold at. His information on the false apostolic movement and Rick Warrens mentor C. Peter Wagner is very good and I heartily endorse Sandys material. Sandy is on the same page with me on Rick Warren as well as other topics of false teaching that continues to hit and weaken the church.

Other must also consider Sandy a reliable source of information because Sandy's website gets over

1 million hits a month.

Here is a link to Sandys website

Here is the article-

Doctrines Fueling The Third Wave

by Sandy Simpson, 1999


The Calvinism vs. Arminianism Debate


It has become my considered opinion that part of the delusion of the Third Wave is facilitated, not only by certain doctrines in Arminianism and semi-Pelagianism, but also by certain doctrines of Calvinism (Once Saved Always Saved). Both doctrinal systems have fatal flaws.

Please understand that the following is my exegesis of Scripture. I admit that I could be wrong and am willing to discuss the points I am making here. Some of the concepts of these doctrinal systems are not easy to explain, prove or disprove. My goal is always to be like Paul who was happy when people checked what he said daily with Scripture (Acts 17:11). I hold Scripture to be the highest authority for the believer in matters of Christian faith and practice. I also hold to the core doctrines of the church, which I will remind the reader of at this point:

1. The Trinity: God must be one "what" and three "who's" with each "who" possessing all the attributes of Deity and personality.
2. The Person of Jesus Christ: Jesus is 100% God and 100% man for all eternity.
3. The Second Coming: Jesus Christ is coming bodily to earth to rule and judge.
4. Salvation: By grace through faith alone in Christ alone.
5. The Scripture: It is entirely inerrant and sufficient for all Christian life.

There are probably a few other doctrines that are VERY important, though not on the level of the above, such as the proper view of the person and work of the Holy Spirit. I do not regard the adherence to either strict Calvinism or strict Arminianism as on the same level as the core doctrines even though this debate is VERY important. Therefore we can argue these issues and still remain in unity as Christians. However, I do believe that anyone who holds strictly to either camp is wrong and should vigorously examine his position. Many hold to one or more points in either camp, or a mixture of both. Some, like myself, hold to a few points but see an antinomy in others, as well as sometimes error in both views, as I attempt to let the Scriptures form my doctrines, not the other way around.

Let me illustrate why neither doctrinal system is perfect by comparing the two doctrines point for point (all references are NIV unless otherwise indicated):

Arminius believed that the fall of man was not total, maintaining that there was enough good left in man for him to will to accept Jesus Christ unto salvation.


This is very unbiblical since the Bible says:

Jer 17:9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it? (KJV)
Jer 17:9 The heart is deceitful above all things and beyond cure. Who can understand it?
Ro 5:14 Nevertheless, death reigned from the time of Adam to the time of Moses, even over those who did not sin by breaking a command, as did Adam, who was a pattern of the one to come.
Ro 5:12 Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all men, because all sinned--
Ro 3:23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,
Ro 3:10 As it is written: "There is no-one righteous, not even one;

The fall of man was total. Nonetheless, man is capable of believing in Jesus Christ for his salvation, responding to the conviction of the Holy Spirit.

Joh 16:8 When he comes, he (the Holy Spirit) will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment:

The Calvinists believed that man is in absolute bondage to sin and Satan, unable to exercise his own will to trust in Jesus Christ without the help of God.


It is true that man is in absolute bondage to sin and Satan, until the Holy Spirit convicts a man of his sin and he repents and believes. We absolutely do need the "help of God". But a man does need to exercise his will by believing. Man is not a robot. The Spirit convicts. Man has to believe, an act of the will.

Joh 16:8 When he comes, he (the Holy Spirit) will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment:
Heb 11:6 And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him.
Acts 16:30-31 He then brought them out and asked, "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?" They replied, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved--you and your household."
Joh 3:18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.
1Jo 5:10 Anyone who believes in the Son of God has this testimony in his heart. Anyone who does not believe God has made him out to be a liar, because he has not believed the testimony God has given about his Son.

Arminius believed that election was based on the foreknowledge of God as to who would believe. Man's "act of faith" was seen as the "condition" or his being elected to eternal life, since God foresaw him exercising his free will in response to Jesus Christ.


God did not predestine man for either hell or heaven, but rather predestined those He foreknew who would be saved. If this were not so then the Bible would be untruthful in stating:

2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. (KJV)
Joh 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me. (KJV)
Joh 12:32 And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself. (NRSV)
2Co 5:15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again. (KJV)
Joh 6:40 For my Father's will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day."

God did choose men according to His foreknowledge of their free will response to salvation offered through Jesus Christ.

1Pe 1:2 who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, for obedience to Jesus Christ and sprinkling by his blood: Grace and peace be yours in abundance.
Ro 11:2 God did not reject his people, whom he foreknew.
Mr 16:16 Whoever believes and is baptised will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.
Ro 10:9 That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
Ro 10:10 For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved.

In some places only "foreknowledge" is mentioned as in Rom. 11, and in others only "predestination" is mentioned as in Eph. 1. But it is noteworthy to notice that the word "foreknew" precedes the word "predestined" in the following passage that OSAS people use as one of their major proofs for predestination:

Ro 8:29-30 For those God foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the likeness of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified.

I believe that predestination as a result of foreknowledge is the key to beginning to understand the antinomy of predestination versus God not being willing "that any should perish". This is one of the most difficult concepts to explain or understand that is taught in the Bible.

The Calvinists believed that foreknowledge is based upon the plan and purpose of God, and that election is not based upon the decision of man, but the "free will" of the Creator alone.


Predestination is a result of foreknowledge, as we have already covered in Rom. 8:29-30. Foreknowledge IS based upon God's plan, but His plan for the salvation of all men.

2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. (KJV)
Joh 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me. (KJV)
2Co 5:15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again. (KJV)

Election is a biblical fact.

Mt 24:22 If those days had not been cut short, no-one would survive, but for the sake of the elect those days will be shortened.

But election (with regard to the New Covenant) is not based on some choice by God to reject some men and redeem others, which would not be consistent with the Word and the Testimony of His character of justice and grace, but based on whether or not a man chooses to believe in Jesus Christ.

2Pe 1:10 Therefore, my brothers, be all the more eager to make your calling and election sure. For if you do these things, you will never fall,
John 20:31 But these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.

Jesus was an example for us and proved Himself by signs and miracles so that men might see them and make a conscious decision to believe.

Ro 3:22 This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe.

Salvation comes through faith alone, not by chance or robotic behavior.

Arminius held that redemption was based on the fact that God loves everybody, that Christ died for everyone, and that the Father is not willing that any should perish. The death of Christ provided the grounds for God to save all men, but each must exercise his own "free will" in order to be saved.


God loves everyone.

1Jo 4:9 This is how God showed his love among us: He sent his one and only Son into the world that we might live through him.
1Jo 4:10 This is love: not that we loved God, but that he loved us and sent his Son as an atoning sacrifice for our sins.
Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

He loved us even though we, at one time, did not love Him. He died for everyone.

2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. (KJV)
Joh 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me. (KJV)
2Co 5:15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again. (KJV)
Joh 6:40 For my Father's will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day."

We must exercise our will to claim salvation bought for us on Calvary.

Eph 1:13 And you also were included in Christ when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation. Having believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit,

If we have no faith the gospel is of no value to us.

Heb 4:2 For we also have had the gospel preached to us, just as they did; but the message they heard was of no value to them, because those who heard did not combine it with faith.

The Calvinists believed that Jesus Christ died to save those who were given to Him by the Father in eternity past. In their view, all for whom Jesus died (the elect) will be saved, and all for whom He did not die (the non elect) will be lost.


God did give Jesus Christ the inheritance of the saved from eternity past.

Eph 1:5 he predestined us to be adopted as his sons through Jesus Christ, in accordance with his pleasure and will--

However, this truth becomes an antinomy with this truth:

2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. (KJV)

Jesus did not just die for a select few, but for all men:

2Co 5:15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again. (KJV)
Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

All for whom Christ died will be saved if they believe, and not saved if they do not believe:

Joh 3:18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.
Mr 16:16 Whoever believes and is baptised will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.

Arminius believed that since God wanted all men to be saved, He sent the Holy Spirit to "woo" all men to Christ, but since man has absolute "free will," he is able to resist God's will for his life. He believed that God's will to save all men can be frustrated by the finite will of man. He also taught that man exercises his own will first, and then is born again.


God does want all men to be saved:

2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. (KJV) < span>r>Joh 6:40 For my Father's will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day."

There is no Scripture that talks about the Holy Spirit "wooing" men to Christ. However, the Holy Spirit does convict men of sin:

Joh 16:8 When he comes, he (the Holy Spirit) will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment:

Man is able to resist the Spirit and His call to repentance and salvation. Some Jews resisted the Holy Spirit and were lost unless they repented.

Ac 7:51 "You stiff-necked people, with uncircumcised hearts and ears! You are just like your fathers: You always resist the Holy Spirit!
1Jo 5:16 If anyone sees his brother commit a sin that does not lead to death, he should pray and God will give him life. I refer to those whose sin does not lead to death. There is a sin that leads to death. I am not saying that he should pray about that.

The "sin that leads to death" is probably resisting the conviction of the Holy Spirit and salvation offered by Christ to all men. God's will, however, cannot be thwarted by men.

Heb 6:17 Because God wanted to make the unchanging nature of his purpose very clear to the heirs of what was promised, he confirmed it with an oath.
Nu 23:19 God is not a man, that he should lie, nor a son of man, that he should change his mind. Does he speak and then not act? Does he promise and not fulfil?

God may change His mind when He chooses to, sometimes at the request or repentance of men, and for His own glory and purposes, but His will cannot be thwarted.

Ex. 32:11-14 And Moses besought the LORD his God, and said, LORD, why doth thy wrath wax hot against thy people, which thou hast brought forth out of the land of Egypt with great power, and with a mighty hand? Wherefore should the Egyptians speak, and say, For mischief did he bring them out, to slay them in the mountains, and to consume them from the face of the earth? Turn from thy fierce wrath, and repent of this evil against thy people. Remember Abraham, Isaac, and Israel, thy servants, to whom thou swarest by thine own self, and saidst unto them, I will multiply your seed as the stars of heaven, and all this land that I have spoken of will I give unto your seed, and they shall inherit it for ever. And the LORD repented of the evil which he thought to do unto his people.

But it is true that a man must believe and be born again.

John 3:2-3 He came to Jesus at night and said, "Rabbi, we know you are a teacher who has come from God. For no-one could perform the miraculous signs you are doing if God were not with him." In reply Jesus declared, "I tell you the truth, no-one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again."
Ro 10:10 For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved.

The Calvinists believed that the Lord possesses irresistible grace that cannot be obstructed. They taught that the free will of man is so far removed from salvation, that the elect are regenerated (made spiritually alive) by God even before expressing faith in Jesus Christ for salvation. If a totally depraved person wasn't made alive by the Holy Spirit, such a calling on God would be impossible.


Salvation is conditional, applied by grace through our faith. Remember: Salvation is by grace alone through faith alone in Christ alone. It is by the grace of Christ alone that salvation was afforded to men, not by works lest any man should boast. It is by faith alone that salvation by grace alone is applied to our lives. We lay hold of the miracle of grace by faith.

Ro 10:9-10 That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved.

A man can resist the grace of God. Not to believe when convicted by the Spirit is to resist the Spirit.

Mr 16:16 Whoever believes and is baptised will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.
Ac 7:51 "You stiff-necked people, with uncircumcised hearts and ears! You are just like your fathers: You always resist the Holy Spirit!

A person cannot resist the Spirit unless the Spirit is at work in him. The Spirit was at work among the Jews in the above instance, but there were those who resisted grace. A person who is a believer can even grieve the Holy Spirit.

Eph 4:30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, with whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.

To say that "the elect are regenerated (made spiritually alive) by God even before expressing faith in Jesus Christ for salvation." is a very unbiblical doctrine. The Bible is clear about the terms of our salvation, purchased for us by Jesus Christ. We must believe!

Ro 10:9-10 That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved.
Ro 3:22 This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe.
Ga 3:22 But the Scripture declares that the whole world is a prisoner of sin, so that what was promised, being given through faith in Jesus Christ, might be given to those who believe.
1Ti 1:16 But for that very reason I was shown mercy so that in me, the worst of sinners, Christ Jesus might display his unlimited patience as an example for those who would believe on him and receive eternal life.

Many unsaved people have called on God. Of course God knows if they will or will not respond, but all men are sinful from the beginning, thus are equally either capable or incapable of believing in Jesus Christ. Since many men have come to a belief in Christ, this proves that a "totally depraved person"—which includes every person who ever lived with the exception of Jesus Christ—can recognize his sin (because of his knowledge of good and evil, his God-given conscience?) and believe because of the conviction of the Holy Spirit, having heard and responded to the gospel message.

Ro 10:17 Consequently, faith comes from hearing the message, and the message is heard through the word of Christ.
Eph 1:13 And you also were included in Christ when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation. Having believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit,

Notice we are not marked with the Holy Spirit’s seal before we believed!

If man cannot be saved by God unless it is man's will to be saved, then man cannot continue in salvation unless he continues to will to be saved.


Man cannot continue in salvation unless he continues to will to be saved, or believe (continuous tense). That is true in one sense.

Ro 10:9-10 That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved.
Ro 3:22 This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe.

However, to state that "man cannot be saved by God unless it is man's will to be saved" is an over-simplification of the facts. God knows who will be saved having foreknown those who would believe. He desires that everyone be saved, but because of His foreknowledge He predestined those He foreknew to salvation. It is His will that everyone be saved, and a certain percentage will be. God's will is therefore ultimately important in the process, since it was He who provided salvation through His Son—reaching out to us. There is also a necessity of belief on the part of His creatures to claim that free gift of salvation.

The Calvinists believed that salvation is entirely the work of the Lord, and that man has absolutely nothing to do with the process. The saints will persevere because God will see to it that He will finish the work He has begun.


Jesus Christ paid the price. We must believe and trust Him. We do not effect our salvation which is by the grace of Christ alone, but we must believe in the gospel of Jesus Christ for it to be applied to us.

Ro 10:9-10 That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved.
Ro 3:22 This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe.

God will see to it that those who continue to believe will persevere. But they must continue in "His kindness" or be cut off.

Ro 11:22 Consider therefore the kindness and sternness of God: sternness to those who fell, but kindness to you, provided that you continue in his kindness. Otherwise, you also will be cut off.

Paul was confident in prayer that the Philippians would be brought to final salvation because of their perseverance and faith.

Php 1:6 being confident of this, that he who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.

Paul's confidence for the Philippians is one thing. Absolute assurance is another. This verse often used by OSAS adherents must be balanced with the other biblical truths that we can fall away, shrink back, wander from the truth, shipwreck our faith, have our faith destroyed, and be cut off if we cease to continue in His kindness.

Lu 8:13 Those on the rock are the ones who receive the word with joy when they hear it, but they have no root. They believe for a while, but in the time of testing they fall away.
Heb. 6:4 It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, if they fall away, to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.
2Pe 1:10 Therefore, my brothers, be all the more eager to make your calling and election sure. For if you do these things, you will never fall,
Heb. 10:38 But my righteous one will live by faith. And if he shrinks back, I will not be pleased with him."
1Ti 1:19 holding on to faith and a good conscience. Some have rejected these and so have shipwrecked their faith.
2 Tim. 2:17-18 Their teaching will spread like gangrene. Among them are Hymenaeus and Philetus, who have wandered away from the truth. They say that the resurrection has already taken place, and they destroy the faith of some.
Ro 11:22 Consider therefore the kindness and sternness of God: sternness to those who fell, but kindness to you, provided that you continue in his kindness. Otherwise, you also will be cut off.

In Summary

Hopefully I have helped you see the deficiencies in both doctrinal systems. The issue of eternal security versus conditional security is, in some respects, an antinomy. The definition of an antinomy is that it is two truths that are both true yet apparently opposite. We must all return to the Scriptures and take the whole teaching of the Word, instead of relying on these doctrinal systems that are, at best, faulty and at worst, very damaging and unbiblical in certain ways. We must be careful of the doctrines of men:

Mr 7:7 They worship me in vain; their teachings are but rules taught by men.


For five point Calvinists, I recommend reading two books. First the book by Dave Hunt entitled “What Love Is This?”. The second is an 801 page book entitled, "The Believer's Conditional Security" by Daniel Corner. These two books bring some balance back from all the heavy emphasis on OSAS in many ministries today. I must caution that I do not agree with every method and premise in Corner’s refutation of Calvinism, as should be evident by the paper you just read. It is my hope that this book will remind Christians that salvation is by grace alone through faith alone in Christ alone. It‘s good to study the issues of predestination just as it’s good to study the issues of shipwrecking one's faith. Hopefully after careful study a Christian will come to the conclusion that, somehow, both the concepts of predestination and freewill coexist equally in the Word of God and thus we must accept them by faith, even if we cannot fully understand them as one concept together.

In short, God knows who has been saved from beginning to end. We, as created beings, cannot know the final salvation outcome for anyone except for ourselves as we continue in faith believing, though we can rightly discern a person’s current spiritual condition by their doctrine and fruit (Jn. 15:20, 2 Tim. 3:12, 2 pet. 2:7-8, Rom. 6:21, Lk. 8:21, Jam. 2:14, Gal. 1:8-9, ! Cor. 15:1-4, 1 Pet. 4:4, 2 Cor. 6:17-18, Jn. 8:32-36, Rom. 6:16-18). The word “believe” is more accurately translated "continue believing" (continuous tense in the Greek in many passages) till the end. Many strict OSAS teachers promote a "grace without the need for continued faith" and a "salvation based on a past moment of belief" thereby teaching Christians not to really fear God's judgement on their continued habitual sins and lack of faith. This has brought a number of false interpretations of Scripture, and an ignorance of the true grace teachings of Jesus and the Apostles.

One of these false Calvinistic teachings is that believers "can never fall away" (Heb. 6:4-6, Mark 14:27, 2 Pet. 1:10, 1 Cor. 10:12) or "be cut off" (Rom. 11:22) in opposition to clear teaching in Scripture. This causes Christians not to take unrepentant immorality, idolatry, false teachings, false prophecy and the false anointing of the Third Wave as seriously as they should. This is because many OSAS teachers claim that "God will never allow believers to be deceived" even though the Bible includes dire warnings to believers against being deceived by false teachers (2 Pet. 2:1, Luke 21:8, 2 Cor. 11:13, Mt. 24:5,11,24, Eph. 5:6).

Another of the false teachings based on OSAS (this is my opinion, not necessarily Dan Corner's) is that believers cannot be demonized (not speaking of "possession", but "demonization") which is contrary to both Biblical examples of demonization of believers (Job 1:8-9; 2:3; 2:7, 1Sa 16:14-16, 18:10, 19:9, Matt. 15:22-28, Matt. 16:22-23, Mark 1:23, Luke 9:52-56, Luke 13:11-16, John 6:70-71, 13:27 Acts 5:1-11, Acts 8:9-24, 2 Cor. 12:7, Gal. 3:1, 1 Tim. 1:19-20) and Biblical teaching to not give the devil a foothold or to allow the sin nature to control us (Eph. 4:25-27, 1 Cor 5:1-5, 2 Cor 2:10-11, 2 Cor. 11:3-4, 1 Tim. 4:1-2, 2 Tim. 2:24-26).


Copywrite 1999 Sandy Simpson
This document may be distributed if the content is not changed in any way.

Saturday, July 12, 2008

New Todd Bentley article

The Rick Warren, Todd Bentley connection is through the mentor they share in false apostle C. Peter Wagner.
Here is a new article on Todd sent to me by my friend and brother in the Lord John Baker.

Todd Bentley, Fresh Fire Ministries and Lakeland Revival

Compiled By S. E. Ray

Canadian Todd Bentley doesn't look like a minister as some would expect. The 32-year-old openly sports body piercings and tattoos on his arms and neck, which has caused many to question his purpose and motivations.

On April 2, 2008, Bentley was invited by Stephen Strader, pastor of Ignited Church, Lakeland, Florida, to lead a one-week revival. The revival quickly became a religious and media phenomenon, attracting up to 10,000 attendees nightly. It continued after the first week. In addition to showcasing Bentley's evangelism, the revival features colorful light shows and power-chord Christian rock music.

The Ignited Church quickly hired A New York public relations firm to send out press releases claiming "documented healings." Information and webcasts were made available via their website and the revival is streamed live via stream - which received over 1 million hits in the first five weeks of transmissions. After the initial weeks, GOD TV, a religious satellite channel, decided to pre-empt its primetime programming and broadcast the Lakeland meetings nightly.

Stepping back to 1998, the FreshFire Ministry Group asked Bentley to give his testimony at one of their weekly meetings. Soon after, Bentley took over the leadership of the group, which became more of a revival movement. He works with and/or otherwise promotes Patricia King of Extreme Prophetic, and he is also very close to aberrant Kansas City prophet Bob Jones, supports Rick Joyner, as well as such churches as the Toronto Airport Christian Fellowship. Todd Bentley’s neo-Pentecostalism is Latter Rain influenced and Bentley now claims to have William Branham’s ministry angels helping him.

To understanding Todd Bentley's origin of power, one must understand the geneaology from which it sprang. William Branham was born in Berksville, Kentucky, in dire poverty. At the age of 5, he heard "A Voice" who directed him to abstain from coffee, smoking and alcohol. This disembodied Voice was later given credit for his unusual healing powers by William himself. William Branham was fascinated with the Zodiac and Egyptian occultism as his mentor was occultist Franklin Hall. Branham’s obsession with the occult is evident even in his death: his grave is marked by a Masonic occult pyramid atop his grave.

He taught his "Serpent Seed" doctrines in the 1950's, of how Eve had intercourse with the Serpent, and all the seed from Cain are predestined for hell. He even called the handsome serpent the missing link between man and monkey. Branham later declared himself the angel of Rev. 3:13 and 10:7 and prophesied that in 1977, all denominations would be consumed by the Roman Catholics, the rapture would take place and the world would end. Before his death in 1965, his occult healing spirit was transferred to hundreds by the laying on of hands. These people include almost all the major names who operated as "healing" evangelists during that time, and who are still at work today. They took Branham’s mantle through the period known as the Latter Rain, endued by the power of his demonic occult entity. William lived his life in fear and acted under a compulsive-type behavior associated with his life-long demonic oppression.

William Branham is an important figure in modern day charismatic, Pentecostal, and emerging church circles. The reason is that not just his latter rain theology, but also his ’spirit’, and (allegedly) his ministering ’angels’ have been passed onto a new generation of prophets. A ‘badge’ of elitism and favor in the new prophetic movement are those who can boast of having met with Branham’s angel or having a vision of it. Testimonies to these angelic encounters are included on Todd Bentley’s website. Paul Cain, closely linked with William Branham, as well as claiming he works directly with Branham’s angels in a similar manner to Branham. It is he who passed the power onto John Wimber and his Vineyard with the prophetic spirit which in turn infected the multi denominational wider church through the Toronto Blessing. The fruit of this has been the elevation and increase of the ‘tent’ of the Kansas City Prophets, whose role call includes Paul Cain, Marilyn Hickey, Earl Paulk, Oral Roberts, Kenneth Hagin, Kenneth and Gloria Copeland, Benny Hinn and now Todd Bentley to name a few.

The Latter Rain is where the so-called ‘Toronto Blessing’ began. The movement is characterized by a plethora of unorthodox teachings and questionable practices — encouraged and promoted by alleged ‘words,’ ‘prophecies’ and ‘visions’ from God, and accompanied by anything from outbreaks of uncontrollable laughter, people acting as if they were drunk, and claims of having received gold dust (calling card of Emma-O?) or other ’supernatural signs’ from God. Bentley’s teachings and practices place his ministry squarely among the controversial renewal and revival movements.

Michael Horton, who wrote “The Agony of Deceit,” which documents fraud among televangelists, said at an interview, “I have not yet encountered a 'faith healer' who failed to preach a different gospel than the one that we find clearly presented in the New Testament." Many of the faithful are understandably grieved by this bold resurfacing of Apostolic/Third Wave/Latter Rain teaching, which is a mix of New Age teachings and altered Pentecostal methodologies.

Charles Haddon Spurgeon "Prince of Preachers", a British Reformed Baptist preacher who died in 1892 said “Discernment is not a matter of simply telling the difference between what is right and wrong; rather, it is the difference between right and almost right."

Even those sympathetic to Pentecostal theology are apprehensive. Mark Balmer, pastor of the 8,000-person Calvary Church in nearby Melbourne, FL, received so many questions about Bentley that he finally spoke regarding his position. He said he believes "in all the gifts for today, including healing." He also asserted: "We are not heresy hunters." He nonetheless told his congregation "not to attend this counterfeit revival." Lee Grady of Charisma magazine said "Charismatic and Pentecostal leaders are divided over its legitimacy."

As background information, Todd Bentley is relatively a new Christian with no formal training or experience in the exposition of scripture. Bentley openly acknowledges the rougher parts of his juvenile past, including his near-fatal drug overdoses, criminal burglaries, assault, physical abuse of his mother and several stints in prison. In 2001, an article in a secular, conservative political magazine called The Report, prompted a mother to reveal about his molesting her 7 year old boy when Todd was 14. Bentley admitted to The Report “I was involved in a sexual-assault ring." Lieutenant Jeff Johnston, a Salvation Army pastor in Port Alberni, B.C said “It’s one thing to be forgiving, it’s another thing to be stupid,” Lieut. Johnston says. “If you, as a pastor, had someone in your church ministry who had been involved in these things and they ever re-offended, the fact that you knew and didn’t disclose it to parents, take every precaution, would be a huge liability issue.” Christians realize that a soul can be saved by grace from any sin, however he personally claims that he was demon possessed after having been born-again, which poses a problem considering his self-acclaimed position.

A visit to one of Bentley's services suggests that he knows how to turn the big crowds into big money. ATM machines were set up alongside food booths, providing attendees with readily available cash for the offering plate and book purchases. At Todd’s revivals, he sells “anointed” handkerchiefs, and takes money from people so that he may pray over them. This is normal with the people on the Elijah list, who believe God condones taking money from people so that they can prophesy over them.

Todd wrote on the website in 2003 “Now let me talk about an angelic experience with Emma. Twice Bob Jones asked me about this angel that was in Kansas City in 1980: “Todd, have you ever seen the angel by the name of Emma?” He asked me as if he expected that this angel was appearing to me. Surprised, I said, “Bob, who is Emma?” He told me that Emma was the angel that helped birth and start the whole prophetic movement in Kansas City in the 1980s. She was a mothering-type angel that helped nurture the prophetic as it broke out. Within a few weeks of Bob asking me about Emma, I was in a service in Beulah, North Dakota. In the middle of the service I was in conversation with Ivan and another person when in walks Emma. As I stared at the angel with open eyes, the Lord said, “Here’s Emma.” I’m not kidding. She floated a couple of inches off the floor. It was almost like Kathryn Khulman in those old videos when she wore a white dress and looked like she was gliding across the platform. Emma appeared beautiful and young-about 22 years old-but she was old at the same time. She seemed to carry the wisdom, virtue and grace of Proverbs 31 on her life.”

Without any exception that I have found, every questionable spiritual movement is marked by intervening Angels giving guidance, not necessarily God’s Word or the Holy Spirit of Truth. Muhammad, Joseph Smith, Jose Luis De Jesus Miranda, Jerry and Esther Hicks, Rhonda Byrne, Helen Schucman, JZ Knight… the list is long for those who are popular and have spirit guides from the fallen realm. Bob Jones and Todd Bentley and their spirit guide “Emma” are no different. Todd attributes his "miracles" according to his own testimony, is from an angel that he says is called "Emma". It should be interesting to note, in the book of angels, Emma (Imma Ila'ah, feminine, in the Kabbalah) means “Embrace Everything.” Also closely related, another name used is “Emma-O“, which in Japanese mythology means “King of Hell” or Satan.

Todd's progressive "body suit," which is a term for a complete body tattoo, is covered with Japanese symbols, occultism and Christian depictions. Shown in this photo is the warrior Apollo, who in mythology and alchemy, his spiritual and symbolic significance is identical with that of the sun. The spreading golden hairs which crown the god's head have the same meaning as the bow and arrow (sun rays). The Greek name for Apollo is Apollon, which means 'from the depths of the lion". Apollon was the great Olympian god of prophecy, oracles, healing, and the aversion of plague and general harm. He is also call Apollyon in scripture, or Hebrew "Abaddon" (Rev. 9:11) also identified as the king of the demonic "locusts" described in Rev. 9:3-10. The locust was a delivery method of this god, who poisoned his victims. Why would Todd choose to embellish a fierce god of destruction on his body?

One of the tattoos that have puzzled people are the three large Japanese Kanji symbols on his left arm. Eternal Path turned to expert Takanori Tomita, a native speaker of Japanese and fluent in English, who translates Kanji, Hiragana, and Katakana Symbols. Kanji are ideographic characters. Each Kanji character represents an entire object, idea, or meaning in a visual character(s). Many Kanji characters are similar to each other, and some can have different meanings depending on context. The first letter on Todd's arm means DAI=Big or Great, the middle one EI=Protect or Defend, the last one OU=King or Monarch. In Japanese, DAIOU is often added to provide honor to the subject of mention. In proper order, it would seem to read "Protect Great King," however not only is the order wrong, but the character in the middle is incorrectly rendered. Furthermore, even if the middle character is used at the top, there's no such word combination like "Protect the Great King". It doesn't make any sense in Japanese even if the order of the characters are corrected and the middle character is properly written. It is not unusual for Western tattoo translations to be in error. The middle symbol does not represent the Chinese character "David" in this context, as is widely speculated.

Alex Mizuno, another individual versed in Japanese tradition and writing styles, who produces Japanese documentaries, revealed that there is a Japanese word "Emma Daioh" which means "Emma, the Great King", which is used very commonly in his culture. This God is sometimes simply called "Emma-sama (sama is added for respect)" or "Emma." Buddhists recognize Emma-sama as Yama, who rules the spirits of the dead in Naraku (hell). He said Todd's erred tattoo was in favor of the latter translation. The tongues of flame accenting the Kanji symbols also support his position depicting the god of Naraku.

After Todd's alleged conversion, he had tattooed under his arm a depiction of Jesus’ crucified upside-down face with a subliminal monkey in the beard. Above the tip of the head, is a tattoo of what is said to be Oni, a “Buddhist guardian devil” of Hell. An argument is lifted up against Todd’s ongoing tattoo additions. Under the old law, it was written:"You shall not make any cuts in your body for the dead nor make any tattoo marks on yourselves: I am the LORD." Leviticus 19:28. Even though Christian's are not under the law to fulfill righteousness, as they are saved by grace, they are to uphold it (Romans 3:31). The question has been asked, why does Todd continue to add graffiti to his body in opposition to the Biblical standard?

The leaders of this revival in question have fruits that should be examined. For example, Bob Jones “was removed from the Vineyard Anaheim because of sexual improprieties, which consisted of encouraging women to undress in his office so they could stand ‘naked before the Lord’ in order to receive a ‘word.’” I am sure as a man; he was moved by pure motivations. Todd “Bam” Bentley runs and kicks people in the stomach with metastatic stage IV colon cancer while ignoring children lined up in wheelchairs, who hope in vain that the revival is real and they might get healed. Instead people leave in a hypnotic state from the charismatic frenzy. Similar events are plaguing Asia, thanks to the West's influence (video - video).

Some attendees speak of new oppressions and those who purported to be healed from a malignant condition die shortly thereafter anyway. It has been questioned by some critics of Todd's ministry, all Biblical divine healings lasted for the rest of the person's natural life, why doesn't his? Todd and those serving with him claim documentation to support numerious healings, 50,000 in 90 days, however when pressed by Geraldo Rivera on FoxNews (video) and ABC Nightline (P1 - P2), nothing has been provided to date, despite Todd's promise to reveal proof.

In Jesus' time, healings were not debated over as if they were legitimate. It was undeniable and plainly evident to all, skeptics and believers alike. In Matthew 11:5, Jesus was recording as responding to John the Baptists question "Are you the one who was to come, or should we expect someone else?" Christ responded, "The blind receive sight, the lame walk, those who have leprosy are cured, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, and the good news is preached to the poor." No regenerative miracles are evident at Todd's revival, despite his claims, however some non-regenerative type healings are reported.

Author's Note: We would have added ministry videos to this article, but the Spirit was clear about not doing so. I have also read in other places, people receiving the same word. Even though video is not live, the essence of the hypnotic and ethereal power is relayed in these videos. I do not encourage anyone to seek these out to investigate less the news reports.

How does one explain minor healings if there is in fact a question regarding the authenticity of Todd's manifestations? We are warned explicitly in Scripture that the devil transforms himself into an angel of light", and that in the last days will come 'Lying signs and wonders' that will "deceive if possible the very elect." Paranormal healing has been in existence in the world since the creation, performed by shaman and faith healers. It is the oldest healing art. But the problem with this type of healing is that it is a lying wonder and opens the door to demonic influence, demonization, even possession. A lying wonder is not necessarily a false wonder or false miracle, but it is, more importantly, a miracle claimed to be from God but whose source is really from the realm of darkness. This type of healing leads the person into bondage to the enemy, symptoms that some recipients have reporting under Todd's revival.

Rev. Jeff White, a pastor at a local Missionary church in Lakeland, heard so much talk about Todd Bentley and the revival tent that he wanted to see it for himself. He struggled with what he saw. “I’ve had to fight skepticism and cynicism because I truly believe that God heals. I really believe his powers are real and it is for today,” White said. “I can’t say that my spirit enters in and joins in with some of the things we’ve seen here tonight.”

Attaining a trance-like state as many do at these revivals, doesn't immediately reveal anything about the origin of the manifestation. Every spiritual manifestation can have one of three different origins (divine, demonic or human). The discerning of spirits is necessary to identify the origin. Because the same manifestation, like falling down and shaking violently or tongues for example, can be caused either by God's Spirit, by a demonic influence or merely by the person's own propagations. Trances, prophetic ecstasy and manifestations are expounded from both the Old and New Testament. Interesting occurrences of ecstasy can be found in the biblical stories of Adam, Abraham, David and Saul, Daniel, Peter, and Paul.

Undisputedly, there have been revivals in Europe and other parts of the world since the Early Church. A very long time before John Wesley, Jonathan Edwards, Smith Wigglesworth or the Pentecostal awakening, Europe has experienced the gifts of the Holy Spirit, healing, deliverance, manifestations of the Holy Spirit. The gifts and manifestations of the Holy Spirit have been present non-stop since the Apostles. Church history clearly reveals this fact. However, a believer must be wise as a serpent, but gentle as a dove regarding the testimony of the leaders of such movements, comparing their words and actions to the Word of God. We are to test all things and hold fast to what is good.

Much of what is touted as Spiritual anointing by the charismatics is merely the awakening of the Kundalini by means of ancient occult methods. Kundalini is a well known occult practice, deriving its origin from India. It involves bodily manifestations as a consequence to the ‘Awakening of the Kundalini.’ This is not a mystical fabrication or belief system, but a practice that is strongly promoted by the New Age Movement (2006 Article Here). The Kundalini awakening does contain the most unbelievable expanded states of reality, enlightenment, and absolute ecstasy and it is extremely contagious. However, like crack stimulates dopamine, a Kundalini awakening opens wide a person's spiritual core, removing safeguards placed by the Creator. The end results can traumatize the spiritual essence and leave a soul scarred for life.

At the beginning of the Florida Outpouring, Todd claimed that God had requested that he lay hands on everyone present for ten nights of special transfer or impartation. This power in the occult is called the shaktipat. “Shakti” means power or energy, and “pat” means transfer. Kundalini awakening or (shaktipat) is the infusion of energy from the spiritual master to the seeker, bringing about the awakening of the seeker’s own inherent spiritual power, called “Kundalini.” Todd described this transferable “anointing” as the most contagious he had ever experienced. He said "I used to feel the anointing in my hand; now I feel it in my spine." It is true that the occult Kundalini awakening does indeed start in the lower spine.

The meetings which mystic Hindu gurus hold are called ‘Darshan’. At these meetings devotees go forward to receive spiritual experience from a touch by the open palm of the hand, often to the forehead, by the guru in what is known as the Shakti Pat or divine touch. In a group setting, the transfer of this power will spread like fire to all in attendance who are mentally open and receive the touch which results in all manner of physical manifestations. Involuntary bodily movements; jerking, tremors, shaking; spontaneous vocalizations; burning sensation; sounds in the head; confusion and stupor; gyrating and pulsating; or when slain, unable to move. These manifestations are called 'Kriyas' by the Hindus. Often devotees move on to higher states of spiritual consciousness and become inert physically and appear to slip into unconscious stupor. This state is called 'Samadhi' and it leads to a deeper spiritual experience. The Buddhist suttas mention that samadhi practitioners may develop supernormal powers that can lead to very uncomfortable occult manifestations.

The late John Murray, Professor of Systematic Theology at Westminster Theological Seminary, who died in 1975 said “the difference between truth and error is not a chasm but a razor’s edge.”

There will be many false workers, or many “Who are called by His name”, but very few will be genuinely authentic, this is just the facts (Matthew 7:22). The anointed servant are those who work without seeking recognition or fanfare as Christ and the Apostles humbly served. The Holy Spirit filled doesn’t seek fame, recognition, money and may never be known, such is the humble and contrite of heart. Those of the Pharisee spirit, egocentric and endued by principalities and powers, seek an exuberant audience, accolades, affirmation, financial gain and make a spectacle of the precious gifts of God like a side show circus. Those given to the extreme charismatic (emotional or fleshly) bent are susceptible prey to these types of leaders, whereas such is the power of hypnotic manipulation through the drone of their voice.

Let us stop for a moment and ponder, least we forget, "God is not the author of confusion, but of peace. As in all the churches of the saints." 1 Cor. 14:33. The Lord told Elijah to stand on the mountain "Then a great and powerful wind tore the mountains apart and shattered the rocks before the LORD, but the LORD was not in the wind. After the wind there was an earthquake, but the LORD was not in the earthquake. After the earthquake came a fire, but the LORD was not in the fire. And after the fire came a gentle whisper. When Elijah heard it, he pulled his cloak over his face..." 1 Kings 19:11-13. God's spirit is NOT present in chaos or the shaking of the physical, His Spirit is found in the quiet, gentle, calm, and peaceful place.

A. W. Tozer sums it up perfectly in his normal etiquette and precision: "Many tender-minded Christians fear to sin against love by daring to inquire into anything that comes wearing the cloak of Christianity and breathing the name of Jesus. They dare not examine the credentials of the latest prophet to hit their town lest they be guilty of rejecting something which may be of God. They timidly remember how the Pharisees refused to accept Christ when He came, and they do not want to be caught in the same snare, so they either reserve judgment or shut their eyes and accept everything without question. This is supposed to indicate a high degree of spirituality. But in sober fact it indicates no such thing. It may indeed be evidence of the absence of the Holy Spirit. Gullibility is not synonymous with spirituality. Faith is not a mental habit leading its possessor to open his mouth and swallow everything that has about it the color of the supernatural. Faith keeps its heart open to whatever is of God, and rejects everything that is not of God, however wonderful it may be. Try the spirits is a command of the Holy Spirit to the Church. We may sin as certainly by approving the spurious as by rejecting the genuine. And the current habit of refusing to take sides is not the way to avoid the question. To appraise things with a heart of love and then to act on the results is an obligation resting upon every Christian in the world. And the more as we see the day approaching."

"I actually live about 45 minutes away from Lakeland, FL where Todd Bentley has set up his camp. Though I did not see him personally, I went just yesterday to Ignited Church that he is connected with. I visited a 10 am service that occurs daily, and there were probably 1,000 people there. Keep in mind that I am a worship leader/young adult pastor at a large non-denominational church, and consider myself a charismatic with a seatbelt on. I do believe in the spiritual gifts, including tongues, prophecy (which I have), and miracles or healing. I prayed to God to let me have an open mind, and for His Holy Spirit to guide me in worship and also in discernment. As I entered the lobby/ cafe area I noticed something right away: No one greeted me and there were no crosses or anything that made me feel like I was at a Christian church. As I walked into the main worship area (that had no hint of anything Christian) the music had just begun and was very hypnotic, building up with chants in tongues by the worship leader and his other vocalists. Right away I felt like I was at a Hindu, Buddhist, or New Age meeting. It was creepy to say the least. Again I prayed to God to help me have an open mind, but I was very distracted by people speaking in a deluge of tongues, and dancing around through the rows of seats. The music went on for about an hour, with the worship leader laughing and jerking uncontrollably, and chanting in tongues between singing and playing a piano. A man then came on stage to introduce a prophetess who was to bring a message from God, a prophecy that she had been given for the church. She immediately began by speaking in tongues, and calling down the glory of God into the room. By this time the congregation had been worked into a frenzy from an hour of hypnotic music and babbling tongues, and was crying out and shaking, and laughing, and crying, and screaming, and dancing, it was all going crazy at once. Again I tried to pray and ask God to help me have an open mind and discernment. It was tough to hear God, to feel God through all the chaos…but then the Spirit quickened a word to me. He reminded me of what Paul wrote in 1 Corinthians 14 about orderly worship. It was then that I left that “church” building as quickly as possible…"
Pastor Mike Kendall ~ The Gathering Quote used by permission for

Another firsthand account worth reading is written by Pastor Jon Speed found HERE.

Scriptures for Reference

“Through thy precepts I get understanding: therefore I hate every false way.” Psalm 119:104

“Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.” 1 John 4:1

“Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.” Matthew 7:15

"At that time if anyone says to you, 'Look, here is the Christ!' or, 'There he is!' do not believe it. For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect—if that were possible. See, I have told you ahead of time." Matthew 24:23-25

"For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.” Jude 1:4

“But the Spirit explicitly says that in later times some will fall away from the faith, paying attention to deceitful spirits and doctrines of demons.” 1 Timothy 4:1

"But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them bringing swift destruction upon themselves. Many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of the truth will be maligned; and in their greed they will exploit you with false words; their judgment from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep." 2 Peter 2:1-3

“I know that after my departure savage wolves will come in among you, not sparing the flock; and from among your own selves men will arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away the disciples after them.” Acts 20:29-30

“See to it that no one takes you captive through hollow and deceptive philosophy, which depends on human tradition and the basic principles of this world rather than on Christ. Do not let anyone who delights in false humility and the worship of angels disqualify you for the prize. Such a person goes into great detail about what he has seen, and his unspiritual mind puffs him up with idle notions. He has lost connection with the Head, from whom the whole body, supported and held together by its ligaments and sinews, grows as God causes it to grow.” Colossians 2:8, 18-19

Monday, July 07, 2008

Rick Warrens lie

Its really scary the influence businessman Rick Warren has among the Christian community. Here is another Rick Warren video from A Little Leaven.

The Dangerous Direction Of Rick Warren

A great article on Rick Warren. Well thought out with great research. Following the article is a link to the site where there are some other really fine sermons to read.

On a side note I want to emphasize Rick Warrens PEACE Plan is not, I repeat not at all about evangelizing the lost. The acronym for P was originally Planting church (which equals planting purpose driven churches-Warrens way not scripture’s way).That was changed to Promoting Reconciliation. Keep in mind that in Rwanda thousands of Purpose Driven Life were handed out instead of Bibles. Rick Warrens agenda is about Rick Warren not Jesus Christ.

Here is the article-
But first lets watch the Todd Friel U Tube video Rick Warren butchering scripture. You should watch this video once a week if you are confused about the real direction Rick Warren is going. For the record I have never heard Warren apologist Richard Abanes touch this video.

The Dangerous Direction of Rick Warren

Heritage of Faith

July 6, 2008

Just before his death, Francis Schaeffer wrote The Great Evangelical Disaster. In it he warned of mainline evangelicalism’s accommodation with theological liberalism and evolution. According to Schaeffer, the evangelical church had become a disaster, namely, by fearing to stand on the truth and contend for the faith! This trend continues as spiritual peril and confusion spread throughout America and the world. Discernment toward doctrinal error seems non-existent and the Biblical doctrine of separation from unbelievers, false teachers, and disobedient brothers is neither mentioned nor practiced.

It is my conviction that spiritual disaster is being currently promoted by Rick Warren, sometimes called “America’s Pastor.” It is my intention to look at God’s Word in light of Warren’s own words and actions so that you can see for yourself the dangers of his pastoral direction to thousands of others churches and pastors.

You might say, “Why is this important for us in NYC?” Well, for a number of reasons. First, Rick Warren has influenced over 500,000 churches with his Church Growth Conference and The Purpose Driven Church. He has further influenced nearly every Christian home in America with The Purpose Driven Life. His influence is now coming to New York City as he partners with a new initiative called, “New York City Leadership Center” and is speaking in a launching event by using his “Forty Days of Purpose” ideology. This partnership includes mega church pastor Bill Hybels and also a New Age promoter and sympathizer Ken Blanchard, along with some of the most well known churches in New York City: Christian Cultural Center, Calvary Baptist Church, and Bethel Gospel Tabernacle. It is imperative that we consider Scriptural admonitions regarding such cooperative efforts. I must issue a warning that the great evangelical disaster Francis Schaeffer warned of is moving in fast forward, and I am not going to be a part of it! I pray that you will stand firmly on the truth as well.

Let me say that I am for unity and love, but this unity must be founded upon doctrinal truth. Jesus Himself said, “To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Everyone that is of the truth heareth my voice” (John 18:37). Jesus did not unify with the Jewish religious establishment of his day, or with the Roman political power. Rather, they crucified Him. Jesus Himself teaches us that His truth is paramount to any unity of man.

Let’s start with Rick Warren’s vision and understanding of his relationship to the church today. He has said,

“I’m looking for a second reformation. The first reformation of the church 500 years ago was about beliefs. This one is going to be about behavior. The first one was about creeds. This one is going to be about deeds. It is not going to be about what does the church believe, but about what is the church doing.” [i] “I am working toward a second Reformation of the church which could create a Third Great Awakening in our nation or world.” [ii]

As Warren perceives himself to be akin to the Reformer Martin Luther or Jonathan Edwards, there are a number of frightening aspects to this statement, the first being:

1. Rick Warren Devalues Sound Doctrine

Rick Warren looks and works for a “Second Reformation” or a “Third Great Awakening” but his are empty of doctrinal content. Friends, both Martin Luther, the Reformer, and Jonathan Edwards, the great pastor of the Great Awakening, were steeped in doctrine! According to Rick, however, this new reformation or awakening will not be about doctrine or creeds but about deeds! Or, Warren’s awakening will not be based upon Jesus Christ’s atonement for sin by the shedding of His blood on the Cross for the forgiveness of sins. It will not be based on the necessity of repentance and faith to receive the precious gift of eternal life by grace alone through faith alone. Rather, it will be demonstrated through a social gospel of human works meeting human felt needs.

Failing to recognize the absolute essentiality of sound doctrine is fatal, for Paul warned that “in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils” (1 Timothy 4:1).

Contrast Warren’s statement with the ministry of the Old Testament prophets, the New Testament apostles, or the work of the first century church! The early church believed in and “continued stedfastly in the apostles’ doctrine,” which was sound doctrine (Acts 2:42). Paul made his doctrine “fully known” and willingly suffered persecution and affliction because of it (2 Timothy 3:10-11). The early church had a clear body of doctrine and the New Testament calls this “THE FAITH” (1 Timothy 4:1; 6:12; Jude 3). They believed Jesus Christ was the virgin born Son of God who shed His blood on the cross for the sins of the world and rose bodily from the grave, and that He was coming again. The early church contended for this, called by Jude “THE FAITH”. Paul warned that “the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine: but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears” (2 Timothy 4:3, 4).

The Apostle John tells us that “many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh,” and those that “abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God”…and “if there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed” (2 John 7-11). In other words, the basis for fellowship and unity in a New Testament church was sound doctrine! We are not to join in cooperative service or a working relationship with unbelievers and false teachers (2 Corinthians 6:14-17). But Rick Warren has erased this standard and made his basis of fellowship one of behavior and deeds, and this will lead to a disastrous Reformation. How can we minimize the doctrine of the Tri-Unity of God and blood atonement when so many are attacking them and false teachers are so prevalent?

Beloved, you cannot reform or see revival in the true church without sound doctrine.

2. Rick Warren Ignores Separating from Unbelievers, Modernists, and even Terrorist Supporting States

Warren’s newest move is to institute a P.E.A.C.E.plan, an acronym that stands for Planting (and Partnering with) Churches, Equipping leaders, Assisting the poor, Caring for the sick, and Educating the next generation. On the surface, I am sure that we can all say, AMEN! It is not his idea that is wrong, but it is HOW he will fulfill this agenda that is troubling and clearly unbiblical.

Rick Warren willingly works with anyone to fulfill this plan. In a PBS interview with Charlie Rose, he says, “You don’t have to change your beliefs for us to work with you. I don’t insist that a Muslim change his belief for me to work on poverty. I don’t even insist that a gay person has to change their beliefs.” [iii]

In 2006, Warren visited the terrorist state, Syria, and gave aid and comfort to this foreign enemy of freedom and the Gospel of Christ. During his visit, Rick made no mention of “Syria’s one-party police state, its political prisoners, its chambers of torture, its support for Hezbollah terrorism in Lebanon, and its continued devotion to the destruction of Israel.” [iv] His visit turned into a propaganda bonanza for the Syrian tyrants. Joseph Farah of World Net Daily exposed Warren’s misguided visit by writing:

“But now that Rick Warren has traveled to and provided legitimacy to a hostile foreign government, presided over by a brutal fascist dictator who hates Jews, threatens Israel, subverts neighboring Lebanon, imprisons and terrorizes its own citizens and even kills them in massive numbers when they stand up in revolt – now I have to denounce this impostor in the strongest terms possible.” [v]

The “P” in his peace plan essentially means therefore that he will partner with any individual, church, religion, or even terrorist state to fulfill this goal! 2 Corinthians 6:14 says, “Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? And what communion hath light with darkness?” Paul concludes, “Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you” (2 Corinthians 6:17). Rick Warren disobeys this clear command.

Consider Warren’s statement in the light of Scripture. Did Jesus enter into Jerusalem where there was poverty, disease, and illiteracy and work with either the Roman government or the Jewish religious establishment to eradicate those earthly problems? Did Jesus say to Pilate, “Let’s work together to eliminate poverty?” Or did He say to Caiaphas, “Let’s join hands, although we don’t agree on everything, to defeat illiteracy?” Preposterous thoughts! Although Jesus cared deeply about those who were suffering, he did not join with unbelievers to establish an earthly kingdom. This was not His ultimate goal, but He came to suffer on the cross for the sins of the world and rise mightily from the dead. While it is fine to help people who are destitute, we must also realize that we can never eliminate poverty. Jesus said in Matthew 26:11, “For ye have the poor always with you; but me ye have not always.”

Did the Apostles enter into a city and work with the pagans and unbelievers to care for the sick or educate the next generation? This is ludicrous! The Apostles went into a city to bring the greatest “help” offered to any man. And this is not a new suit, a meal, or a class on reading. The greatest help you can give to any man is the Gospel of Jesus Christ (Acts 16:7-11). That was the message of Paul in Philippi, Athens, Corinth, Ephesus, or Rome. The Gospel of God’s righteousness! “For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek” (Romans 1:16). And it was this message that led to persecution and people hating him.

For Rick Warren to work alongside homosexuals, Muslims, and Roman Catholics and other non-Christians care more about teaching reading or math than preaching the Gospel is a very unloving thing for a preacher of the Gospel to do! Our mandate from God is to go into the world and preach the everlasting Gospel. This does not mean we ignore human suffering, for Jesus also leads us to provide material help to those in need, but this still is not our primary focus.

“For what is a man profited if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?” (Matthew 16:26).

3. Rick Warren Promotes New Age Spirituality

New Age spirituality is essentially the belief that all the world’s religions are identical at the mystical level and therefore there can be unity among them. It is based on the lie that in the “center of your being is a point of nothingness which is untouched by sin … a point of pure truth …(which) is the pure glory of God in us”, and that it in everybody, according to a popular and well know Roman Catholic mystic, Thomas Merton. [vi]

Shockingly, in his best selling books and on his web site, Rick Warren endorses those who promote and practice New Age spirituality, such as panentheism (God is in all things), mysticism, centering prayer, contemplative prayer, and spiritual formations/disciplines (New Age prayer techniques).

For example, In The Purpose Driven Church, Warren refers to many questionable movements as having a “valid message” for the church that God has used to be a “wake-up call” for the church. Among those he endorses are Richard Foster and Dallas Willard, both of whom practice and promote the “Spiritual formations movement.” [vii] In Richard Foster’s popular book, Celebration of Discipline, there are eleven references to Thomas Merton (quoted above) [viii]

In The Purpose Driven Life Rick Warren enlarges his endorsement of New Age spirituality by citing a Roman Catholic mystic and Carmelite monk named Brother Lawrence as a person we should emulate in prayer. [ix] Brother Lawrence used a form of prayer that made him “dance violently like a madman” when he went into the “presence.” [x] The Carmelite order of monks was heavily influenced by Teresa of Avila whose own thinking was affected by Jewish Kabbalistic mysticism. [xi]

Warren recommends reading another Roman Catholic priest and mystic, Henri Nouwen, by promoting his books on his web site. Henri Nouwen teaches: “The God who dwells in our inner sanctuary is also the God who dwells in the inner sanctuary of each human being.” [xii] That is a bold-faced lie against the truth! A true shepherd should protect the sheep from the statements of such wolves in sheep’s clothing. At the end of his life, Nouwen taught that “all paths lead to God.” [xiii]

In an article on his website entitled “Pastors need Solitude, Refreshment to Prepare for Ministry,” the author quotes Thomas Merton, who is a clear practitioner of New Age spirituality, and then he gives very clear New Age advice for prayer: [xiv]

“The power of silence and solitude has been recognized throughout the history of spiritual formation. It is the purposeful separation of ourselves from the world in order to place ourselves with God. The evil one assaults our senses with the material world to drown out the distant chords of eternity’s symphony. Only in silence can we move past the deafening roar of the world and hear the music of God.” [xv]

Some of these expressions like “power of silence and solitude” and “spiritual formation” seem innocent, but they are phrases straight out of the New Age lexicon. The New Age movement teaches that God is in everyone and everyone is in God, and through silence, meditative trances, mystical experiences, breath prayers, centering prayers, and contemplative prayers, you can find what Thomas Merton himself said is that “point of nothingness which is untouched by sin” where “the pure glory of God (is) in us. It is in everybody.” That is a lie of the grandest order that undermines the truth of God, the Person, and work of Jesus Christ to redeem us on the cross.

Yet, these authors along with their ideas are promoted as commonplace in Rick Warren’s web site (see Take a simple visit there and search names like Robert Schuller, Brennan Manning, Richard Foster, Thomas Merton, Dallas Willard, Tricia Rhodes and Henri Nouwen. All these writers promote varied forms of New Age spirituality. Galatians 1:6-9 clearly tell us to not give honor to anyone who preaches another Gospel. “As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed” (Galatians 1:9).

4. Rick Warren Associates with False Prophets

Rick Warren’s close association with Robert Schuller is well documented. For many years, Warren has yoked together with Schuller’s church growth conferences as a learner and a leader. Robert Schuller is heavily influenced by eastern religions, positive thinking, and is a false prophet in every sense of the word, denying original sin and the absolute need for forgiveness through Christ’s atoning blood.

In 1997, Warren spoke at Schuller’s Institute for Successful Church Leadership. With Warren present, more than eighty gay and lesbian pastors and lay leaders from the Metropolitan Community Churches participated. (Bill Hybels also spoke at that conference.)

How can a good shepherd sit down with such wolves? Jesus tells us to “Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves” (Matthew 7:15). Paul warned the Ephesian pastors that after he departed “grievous wolves” would enter among them, “not sparing the flock” (Acts 20:29). Through the ministry of Rick Warren, false teaching is dripping into the evangelical world like an IV hooked up to a dying patient.

5. Rick Warren Uses Perversions of Scripture and pretends they are True

Let’s consider just one glaring example among many bad paraphrases that Warren chooses to use in his sermons and books. Warren quotes Ephesians 4:6 in The Purpose Driven Life from a modern perversion, New Century Version, that says of our God, “He rules everything and is everywhere and is in everything” (Ephesians 4:6). Here New Age teaching creeps into a perverted Bible translation! [xvi] That God is in everything is the lie at the heart of all New Age teaching. The Bible does not teach that God is in everyone, but that He indwells believers in the Lord Jesus Christ. This is also the offense of the cross that Warren seems so unwilling to accept! It could very well be that Warren uses this verse on purpose, to gain national popularity and he has been heavily influenced by Robert Schuller, who also is clearly immersed in New Age, or Eastern theology.[xvii] Warren also repeatedly quotes the notoriously deficient paraphrase “The Message” by Eugene Peterson.

Perhaps Rick Warren has been reading and quoting modern perversions for so long, that doctrine has become unimportant to him, for these perversions water down the truth until it is hardly recognizable.

6. Rick Warren Wrongly Divides the Scripture

Warren’s usage of various translations allows him to make the Bible say what he wants it to say rather than what it really says. In the following excerpt from The Purpose Driven Life, Warren quotes three people: Isaiah, Job, and Dr. Bernie Siegel. According to Warren, Isaiah and Job, both great and godly men are living “without God and without purpose.” Dr. Siegel, however, understands hope and purpose, and he is a leading New Age author and spokesman! [xviii] Here is Warren’s twisted comment which makes Dr. Siegel more spiritual than either Job or Isaiah:

Without God, life has no purpose, and without purpose, life has no meaning. Without meaning, life has no significance or hope. In the Bible, many different people expressed this hopelessness. Isaiah complained, “I have labored to no purpose; I have spent my strength in vain and for nothing.” Job said, “My life drags by – day after hopeless day” and “I give up; I am tired of living. Leave me alone. My life makes no sense.” The greatest tragedy is not death, but life without purpose.

Hope is as essential to your life as air and water. You need hope to cope. Dr. Bernie Siegel found he could predict which of his cancer patients would go into remission by asking, “Do you want to live to be one hundred?” Those with a deep sense of life purpose answered yes and were the ones most liketly to survive. Hope comes from having a purpose.” [xix]

First, hope does not come from merely a purpose, but hope comes from our God and Lord Jesus Christ as we wait for eternal life. Hope in God, dear friends, not merely a purpose! (Psalm 42:5; 1 Timothy 1:1; Titus 1:2; Romans 15:13; 1 Thessalonians 5: . Secondly, Warren does not quote the context of those passages in Isaiah and Job but only the parts that suit his purpose, not God’s! Isaiah was not “without purpose,” but he was struggling with the fact that while he was doing God’s will, no one seemed to be listening to his message. Isaiah was faithful, but he was discouraged by seeing little outward success. The rest of the verse in Isaiah 49:4 clearly shows that Isaiah was not questioning his purpose. In fact, he draws upon God for great comfort and encouragement. While Warren indicates that Isaiah had “no purpose” or was living “without meaning,” Isaiah actually says:

“I have laboured in vain, I have spent my strength for nought, and in vain: yet surely my judgment is with the LORD, and my work with my God” (Isaiah 49:4).

Warren failed to quote the whole verse! Isaiah commits the labor of his life to God by realizing it was God’s cause and work and God would reward him in due time. Isaiah 49:5 continues Isaiah’s encouraging words as he says:

“Though Israel be not gathered, yet shall I be glorious in the eyes of the LORD, and my God shall be my strength.”

Perhaps Rick Warren should consider that the size of a movement or church has nothing to do with whether something is faithful to God!

Warren Smith in Deceived on Purposeinsightfully writes: “Rick Warren could have wonderfully introduced hope and purpose through the godly lives of Isaiah and Job, but he chose to use them as examples of men who were without hope, purpose, or God in their lives. Instead, he used a New Age leader (Dr. Siegel) to preface his remarks about having a true hope that comes from having a “deep sense of purpose.” [xx] I don’t know about you, but this heightens my sense of righteous indignation in that a so-called Pastor would so disgrace God’s men and use a New Ager as an example for us!

These are just a few of the troubling aspects of the ministry of Rick Warren. Warren mocks Fundamentalism and has said, “There aren’t that many Fundamentalists left in America.” [xxi] May I remind Rick Warren that “might does not make right?” Although Warren may interpret God’s blessing in terms of numbers, God never does. [xxii] There were not many who got into Noah’s Ark. There were not many who accepted the prophetic statements of Isaiah or Jeremiah. There were not many following Jesus when He went to the cross! Nevertheless, there are still some very godly, balanced, loving, and doctrinally sound Biblical fundamentalists and churches throughout our nation, and there is still this one, and as long as God allows, I will contend for the holiness of God and the purity of the Gospel. Friends, we are not living in a day of a new Reformation, but in the last days of perilous apostasy. Let us beware and be wise, staying close to Jesus Christ in rightly dividing His Word until He comes again!


[i]Interview by David Kuo with Rick Warren, accessed July 1, 2008, (

[ii] From Pew Forum, May 23, 2005, “Myths of the Modern Mega Church,” an interview with Rick Warren, accessed July 1, 2008 at

(Note: This is a long article but it shows Warren as currying favor with those who are the intellectuals in our pop culture. The only group on earth that I can find Warren denounce are Bible believing fundamentalists!)

[iii] Roger Oakland, Faith Undone(Silverton, OR: Lighthouse Trails Publishing), p. 146,147.

[iv] Joseph Farah, World Net Daily, accessed July 3, 2008 at

[v] Joseph Farah, World Net Daily, accessed July 3, 2008at

[vi]Ray Yungen, Time of Departing(Silverton, OR: Lighthouse Trails Publishing Company), p. 58-59.

(Note: This book is very helpful in relating “How Ancient Mystical practices are uniting Christians with the World’s religions. It also contains a glossary of terms being used by the proponents of these new age mystical practices)

[vii] Rick Warren, The Purpose Driven Church, (Grand Rapids, MI: Zondervan, 1995), p.126-127.

[viii]Ray Yungen, Time of Departing, p.72.

[ix] Rick Warren, The Purpose Driven Life,(Grand Rapids, MI: Zondervan, 2002), p.88,

[x] Brother Lawrence, The Practice of the Presence of God, translated by John Delaney,( Image Books, 1977), p. 34.

[xi]Ray Yungen, A Time of Departing(Silverton, OR: Lighthouse Trails Publishing Company), p.146-147.

[xii] Roger Oakland, Faith Undone (Silverton, OR: Lighthouse Trails Publishing Company), p. 89-90.

(Note: This book is outstanding in dealing with the mystical practices of the emerging church, exposing it not as a “new reformation but an end-time deception.”)

[xiii] Ibid, p. 100.

[xiv] Ibid, p.164, Thomas Merton also said, ‘We are already one. But we imagine that we are not.”

[xv] Accessed July 1, 2008 from an article entitled, “Pastors Need Solitude and Refreshment,” (

[xvi] Rick Warren, The Purpose Driven Life, p.88.

[xvii] Warren Smith, Deceived on Purpose: The New Age Implications of the Purpose Driven Church (Mountain Stream Press, 2004), p.79-86.

(Note: This book is helpful because Warren Smith was formerly involved in the New Age movement and picks up on New Age mystical terminology creeping into evangelical writings that one not exposed to the movement could easily miss.)

[xviii] Ibid, p.48-51.

[xix] The Purpose Driven Life, p.30-31.

[xx] Deceived on Purpose, p.51.

[xxi] From Pew Forum, May 23, 2005, “Myths of the Modern Mega Church,” an interview with Rick Warren, accessed July 1, 2008 at

[xxii]From an article entitled, “The Gospel According to Hybels and Warren,” accessed June 26, 2008 at

Note: Nathan Busenitz does an excellent job in exposing Warren’s man-centered and pragmatic emphasis in preaching the Gospel.

Heritage Baptist Church, New York City, New York

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