Not The Kind Of Fire You Would Want

You Probably dont want the kind of FIRE advertised by folks like Dan Bohi and various FIRE schools.
Dont take my word for it lets just explore the fire the above folks are talking about giving you in a biblical context from scripture
A verse commonly taken out of context


Matthew 3:11-12

New King James Version (NKJV)



11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.[a] 12 His winnowing fan is in His hand, and He will thoroughly clean out His threshing floor, and gather His wheat into the barn; but He will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.”

Also Luke 3:16-17



Luke 3:16-17

New King James Version (NKJV)



16 John answered, saying to all, “I indeed baptize you with water; but One mightier than I is coming, whose sandal strap I am not worthy to loose. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire. 17 His winnowing fan is in His hand, and He will thoroughly clean out His threshing floor, and gather the wheat into His barn; but the chaff He will burn with unquenchable fire.”



And yes I get it that the Holy Spirit appeared like tongues of fire over the heads of believers at Pentecost. But lets examine these verses and there context.



John the Baptist states He (Jesus) will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.

John does not state Holy Spirit fire. But seperates the two Holy Spirit and fire.

We need to look at the next verse to see the context which John was speaking in.

He states Jesus will gather His wheat into the barn (saved people) but He (Jesus) will burn up the chaff (unsaved people not sin in this context but unrepentant sinners) He with unquenchable fire (the fires of hell). You for sure do not want this type of fire.

How does Jesus describle the Holy Spirit look at John 14

17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.



18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.



19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.



20 At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.



21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.



22 Judas saith unto him, not Iscariot, Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world?



23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.



24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.



25 These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you.



26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.



Then in John 16 Jesus shows the work of the Holy Spirit



The Work of the Holy Spirit

5 “But now I go away to Him who sent Me, and none of you asks Me, ‘Where are You going?’ 6 But because I have said these things to you, sorrow has filled your heart. 7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth. It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you. 8 And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: 9 of sin, because they do not believe in Me; 10 of righteousness, because I go to My Father and you see Me no more; 11 of judgment, because the ruler of this world is judged.



12 “I still have many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. 13 However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come. 14 He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you. 15 All things that the Father has are Mine. Therefore I said that He will take of Mine and declare it to you.[c]



Again not any fire in Jesus's description of the Holy Spirit

Probably a good reason to stay away from FIRE school
The fire they are advertising refers more to what Smith Wiggleworth taught and here is a seperate article refuting Wigglesworth unscriptural take on fire.

http://www.bereanresearchinstitute.com/03_Doctrines/D.0005_01_Wigglesworth_1_of_6_Pentecostal_Baptism_of_Fire.html

FIRE School-Spiritual Gifts For Sale-Only $65.00 Per Person

Acts 8:18-21


New King James Version (NKJV)
18 And when Simon saw that through the laying on of the apostles’ hands the Holy Spirit was given, he offered them money, 19 saying, “Give me this power also, that anyone on whom I lay hands may receive the Holy Spirit.”
20 But Peter said to him, “Your money perish with you, because you thought that the gift of God could be purchased with money! 21 You have neither part nor portion in this matter, for your heart is not right in the sight of God.

Acts 13:8-11


New King James Version (NKJV)
8 But Elymas the sorcerer (for so his name is translated) withstood them, seeking to turn the proconsul away from the faith. 9 Then Saul, who also is called Paul, filled with the Holy Spirit, looked intently at him 10 and said, “O full of all deceit and all fraud, you son of the devil, you enemy of all righteousness, will you not cease perverting the straight ways of the Lord? 11 And now, indeed, the hand of the Lord is upon you, and you shall be blind, not seeing the sun for a time.”
And immediately a dark mist fell on him, and he went around seeking someone to lead him by the hand.

Now the argument could and probably would be made that Simons heart was not right that was his problem so someone with a right heart would be ok paying for spiritual gifts.
Well lets see what church history says as well as the obvious point of scripture that spiritual gifts are not for sale and can not be taught. Also some may bring up that workers are worth being paid but this FIRE school is about selling spiritual gifts and selling false revival to your church at an even heaftier price than the initial $65.00 per person.

Simony- (pron. [ˈsaɪ.mə.ni] or [ˈsɪ.mə.ni]) is the act of paying to receive sacraments, including those for ordination to a holy office or other position in the hierarchy of a church. The practice is named after Simon Magus, who is described in the Acts of the Apostles 8:9-24 as having offered two disciples of Jesus, Peter and John, payment in exchange for their empowering him to impart the power of the Holy Spirit to anyone on whom he would place his hands. This is the origin of the term simony;but it also extends to other forms of trafficking for money in "spiritual things".



The FIRE School people who are promoting Dan Bohi at these meetings and classes quote Phenius Bresee at the bottom of their banner saying ""We must have new Pentecosts; manifestations which will shake the place where we are assembled and shake the hearts of men..."  No where on Google or Bing could I find this quote attributed to Bresee no where to be found at all .

Phineas Bresse did say concerning Azuza Street
"Some months ago, among some of the colored people in this city, reinforced after a little with some whites, there began something which was called the “gift of tongues.” The meetings were held in a large rented building on Azusa Street. The professed gift of tongues was not the only peculiarity of the meetings, but much physical exercise of various kinds, with laying on of hands. The meetings attracted some attention, especially among that class of people who are always seeking for some new thing. "

When Bresee referred to physical exercise of various kinds with laying on of hands. He was referring to manifestations not of the Holy Spirit such as slain in the spirit and the other weird manifestations at Azuza Street.
Bresee took the denomination away from this.
Now Dan Bohi and FIRE Schools are trying to bring them back to what history shows Bresee rejected.

Phineas Bresse also stated
"but what little influence it has had seems to have been mostly harmful, instead of beneficent. It seems not only to have had at least some of the elements of fanaticism, but to be trying to inculcate such erroneous or heretical doctrines as mark it as not of the Spirit of Truth. The two principal things which are emphasized, and wherein they claim to differ from others, is, that Christians are sanctified before they receive the baptism with the Holy Ghost, this baptism being a gift of power upon the sanctified life, and that the essential and necessary evidence of the baptism is the gift of speaking with new tongues.
As far as has come under our own observation, or that we have seen experted by competent examination, the speaking with tongues has been a “no-thing,” a jargon, a senseless mumble, without meaning to those who do the mumbling, or to those who hear. Where in a few instances the speaker or some other one has attempted to interpret, it has usually been a poor mess.

It would be doing the few poor people who have been deluded by this thing no wrong to say that among clearheaded, faithful, reliable Christian people of this city the thing has no standing.

We are surprised at reputable papers giving credence to the almost unthinkably extravagant utterances in reference to such a matter before attempting to know whether there was anything to it or not. "

source  http://www.azusastreet.org/AzusaStreetBresee.htm

I have heard that Dan has been asked not to do certain things in certain Nazarene churches.
But can the true Holy Spirit be turned on and off like some water faucet?
For shure not because He is fully God and is not something conjured up or not by man at his whim and bidding.
Keep in mind Dan Bohi has stated Jesus is speaking new truth to him.
Also here was our interaction from someone who has been prepped and controlled by these people who are selling spiritual gifts for money.

The following is why I quoted the above verse that shows someone was struck blind. Many people are now being struck by spiritual blindness.

Manny and I had a very interesting conversation with a young lady and Rob McCorkle left before we had a chance to speak with him. I'm going to write a more detailed article on this Sat. The jest of it was I tried to ask this young lady where she found these manifestations I scripture. She said people fell forward. I said exactly only Jesus's enemies fell backward when they came to arrest Him. This girl was really trying to control the conversation often cutting off me and Manny trying to not let us speak. Manny bought up that no preacher is above scrutiny.

Than on that I went into what Dan preached giving exact quotes and I asked her if she thought the teaching matched up to scripture. I also pointed out where Dan actually stated he didn't like the definition of faith expressed in the book of Hebrews and than gave his own definition of faith outside of scripture by way of revelation knowledge I guess. Then things got ugly quick. She stated she knows the Holy Spirit and almost implied I wasn't saved. She said she fell to her knees and her arms were so heavy she could not move her arms. We questioned her experience and Manny asked her if she could be deceived. She stated no way because she knows the way the holy Spirit moves. I asked her where is this found in scripture. She could not answer. Than an older lady came by and stated she never believed in the stuff either until she went and was bought to her knees feeling a heavyness and was actually paralzed and could not move either. I asked again where is this expereince in scripture. I asked the young lady again about Dans teaching and how the Nazarene founder distanced himself from Azuza street and its manifestations.

She than informed us we are not to question the annointed. I explained to her that if you are saved you are annointed by the Holy Spirit for service. She than stated "I'm done here and I want you both to leave this area right now". Even though her young man counterpart wanted to talk more. I actually apoligized to her for upsetting her. She said "leave now". I can tell you this whole encounter was not cult like, it was plain cultish. This is what leaders like Bohi get, a cult following. I also had a nice and civil conversation with a female evangelist who I know and love dearly. It was difficult to get anything out of my mouth but I told her the Hebrews definition of faith by Bohi. And she said she disagreed with that. I told her about Bill Johnson but she said Dan told her he only watched him a little on tv and wrote down one thing he thought was good. So where is Dans responsibility to not expose people to false teachers.

Than I tried to give her a copy of Mannys article on Bohi which she refused to look at. Shw was nice and we are still friends but look at this cult type adoration of Bohi. People not willing to be faithful Bereans and check to see if what's taught and going on is true in scriptures. Something that would stop you from checking scripture because they state they don't want to limit God I quarentee you that spirit is not of God. Folks the following the church back to Rome is here. Emergent is dug in and not even an issue anymore because its in to deep.
 Plus the false revival and signs and wonders movement is here and not going anywhere as well. And things with Bohis revivals are mild now compared to what they will get to once people are used to the false manifestations. This is conditioning by the enemy. And trust me as people buy in more and more will be served out as they want more and more. I've seen it before. People forget I was freed out of this movement.

Fire School Part 2

Ok so at the Nazarene GA we saw the latest Naz fad/heresy big fire school/Bohi promotion. Manny and I had a very interesting conversation with a young lady and Rob Mckorkle left before we had a chance to speak with him. I'm going to write a more detailed article on this Sat. The jest of it was I tried to ask this young lady where she found these manifestations I scripture. She said people fell forward. I said exactly only Jesus's enemies fell backward when they came to arrest Him. This girl was really trying to control the conversation often cutting off me and Manny trying to not let us speak. Manny bought up that no preacher is above scrutiny. Than on that I went into what Dan preached giving exact quotes and I asked her if she thought the teaching matched up to scripture. I also pointed out where Dan actually stated he didn't like the definition of faith expressed in the book of Hebrews and than gave his own definition of faith outside of scripture by way of revelation knowledge I guess.

Then things got ugly quick. She stated she knows the Holy Spirit and almost implied I wasn't saved. She said she fell to her knees and her arms were so heavy she could not move her arms. We questioned her experience and Manny asked her if she could be deceived. She stated no way because she knows the way the holy Spirit moves. I asked her where is this found in scripture. She could not answer. Than an older lady came by and stated she never believed in the stuff either until she went and was bought to her knees feeling a heavyness and was actually paralzed and could not move either. I asked again where is this expereince in scripture. I asked the young lady again about Dans teaching and how the Nazarene founder distanced himself from Azuza street and its manifestations. She than informed us we are not to question the annointed. I explained to her that if you are saved you are annointed by the Holy Spirit for service.

 She than stated "I'm done here and I want you both to leave this area right now". Even though her young man counterpart wanted to talk more. I actually apoligized to her for upsetting her. She said "leave now". I can tell you this whole encounter was not cult like, it was plain cultish. This is what leaders like Bohi get, a cult following. I also had a nice and civil conversation with a female evangelist who I know and love dearly. It was difficult to get anything out of my mouth but I told her the Hebrews definition of faith by Bohi. And she said she disagreed with that. I told her about Bill Johnson but she said Dan told her he only watched him a little on tv and wrote down one thing he thought was good. So where is Dans responsibility to not expose people to false teachers. Than I tried to give her a copy of Mannys article on Bohi which she refused to look at. Shw was nice and we are still friends but look at this cult type adoration of Bohi.

 People not willing to be faithful Bereans and check to see if what's taught and going on is true in scriptures. Something that would stop you from checking scripture because they state they don't want to limit God I quarentee you that spirit is not of God. Folks the following the church back to Rome is here. Emergent is dug in and not even an issue anymore because its in to deep. Plus the false revival and signs and wonders movement is here and not going anywhere as well. And things with Bohis revivals are mild now compared to what they will get to once people are used to the false manifestations. This is conditioning by the enemy. And trust me as people buy in more and more will be served out as they want more and more. I've seen it before. People forget I was freed out of this movement. We really need to pray for these people Bohi and those like him really have these poor folks in a cult type hold. This spirit is not of the Lord. Manny thanks for an exciting time playing good cop bad cop. Get some rest my dear brother

Is everyone our brother and sister?

Here is where scripture clears up the confusion caused by professors and people who do not know what scriptures teach. These days in this time of great deception and apostasy we would have direction to call just about any brothers and sister in the Lord.


Well scripture addresses how we should act.

Matt 6:43-48 states you have heard that it was said , You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy. But I say to you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven. For he makes his sun rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the just and the unjust. For if you love those who love you what reward do you have? Do not even the tax collectors do the same? And if you greet only your brothers, what more are you doing than others? Do not even the Gentiles do the same? You therefore must be perfect as your heavenly Father is perfect. End verse

Notice how guys like Rick Warren call Muslims and those like Catholics from other religions brother.

Our Lord clearly defines and shows that brothers are different. He means those that share our mutual faith.

Now that clearly does not give us permission to not be nice and loving to those of different religion or no religion. We are to love them all. But you know what if you love someone you would not want them to spend eternity in hell. If you love people you will also lead them away from false teaching through the scriptures.

And you know sometimes even if we do something in a loving way if you disagree and try to correct even in love you are viewed as unloving. But letting people be in the bondage of false teaching or possibly spending eternity in hell is not true love at all.

How many of us have had to use tough love on our kids have them turn around and scream I hate you and you don't love me. Because we don't let them do whatever they want to do even if it will hurt them.

Those who follow false teachers feel the same way toward us. But its really out of love we do this. But let's do it as lovingly as we can. Coming from a drummer who knows how a clanging cymbal sounds up close and personal.

Fire Schools do we need them Part One-Does our lack of faith hinder God?

Usually I will start out with false teaching and than follow up with the truth of scripture. I'm starting this of with the truth of scripture.

The question is can our faith limit Gods power? If so we would need fire schools I guess for 65 dollars a person mind you. Wow free spiritual gifts (note the word free) for sale for only 65 a person and you wont just get one but multiple because we are going to teach you how to get and use these free gifts from God. Wow can someone jump up and SHOUT GLORY. What a deal of the century.
But can our faith limit God?
Last year I began to notice a common underlying theme and assumption in evangelical preachers which is: your faith is the limiting factor in God’s agency. Sunday after Sunday believers are exhorted to believe harder, perhaps coupled with prayer, that God will act to heal, to revive, to convert and save people and communities. But is it really our lack of faith (i.e. belief) which is holding God back?


The Gospels especially provide numerous convenient examples which would seem to support the idea that God cannot or doesn’t act miraculously unless people believe. Jesus is said to have done less miracles in towns which did not believe and we all know the expression, characteristic of various heeling's that “your faith has healed you” (e.g Mk 10:52). Less well known are the instances where someone is healed because of another person’s faith (the centurion’s servant in Mk 8, the lame man in Mk 2, Jairus’ daughter Mk 5). It would seem that someone, preferably nearby, needs to believe for miracles to occur!
Not, so. Jesus feeds the multitude twice though no one thought it possible (see John 6). Obviously Lazarus was raised when he was dead and past believing (though his sisters believed) but Jesus himself was raised by divine fiat when nobody believed it would happen. If we look closely we see that Jesus was indeed able to heal people in unbelieving villages by laying hands on them! (Mt 13:58; Mk 6:5) In fact, the evangelist does not say that he could not do miracles because of a lack of faith but simply that he did not
The idea that Jesus’ power is limited by man’s belief is rather absurd and arbitrary. In those cases where miracles were not forthcoming it seems more from Jesus’ own choice rather than him somehow being limited in agency. It is Jesus who tells the Pharisees that “no sign will be given”, the ball is always in His court! We may be limited to His Grace but His Grace is not limited by anything.
This has massive implications for our theology. Evangelical theology teaches that we must believe in order to be saved. Confusingly the word for “save” and the word for “heal” are the same in Greek but this should not allow us to project “your faith has healed you” onto our ideas of soteriology. It is always God who saves and His salvation is for everyone, regardless of whether they believe or not. Paul says it like this:
This is a trustworthy saying that deserves full acceptance. That is why we labour and strive, because we have put our hope in the living God, who is the Saviour of all people, especially those who believe (1 Tim 4:9-10)
Too many Christians are worried that their unbelieving friends and family are outside of God’s grace, power and salvation. At best, their hope and prayer is that God will open that person’s heart to believe so that they may be saved. I do not wish to deny that faith and salvation are related but simply note that the faith which saves is not something outside and external to God, something out of His control, preventing Him from saving us. I agree with the Calvinists here: God produces faith, salvation is wholly from God.
Calvinists teach that regeneration precedes faith which is the idea that God awakes the sinner “from death to life” before that person believes. God’s action is prior to the person’s decision to believe. Indeed, most Calvinists would deny that we choose to believe but that faith is from God. As N.T. Wright puts it, the hearer of the Gospel strangely finds themselves believing it, believing the absurd proclamation that Jesus is Lord!
If one considers this for a moment it makes much sense. Which of us chose to believe in God or in the Gospel or in the miraculous? Rather, we found that, at some point we did believe it. Did we produce this faith or was it God? I think it was God. Faith is a sign, an awareness, but not a condition of salvation which is by God’s grace and His faithfulness (Eph 2:8).

But this faith, this belief that something is true must be differentiated from other aspects of conversion such as repentance and trust unto obedience. We must indeed choose to turn from sin, to confess it, to strive to obey God and trust in his sovereign authority over us, even when it seems crazy. This wilful transfer of power from ourselves and our reason over to God is something we do not just once but daily. The liberation from sin described in Romans 6 and 7 is all about the struggle we have to obey our new master God and not the old master called “Sin”. God justifies, and just as Jesus defeated Sin and Death, so must we die “with” him in baptism (the choice to live to God) and defeat Sin (by not obeying it) and Death (by one day being raised to new life)
And so the problem is not the world’s lack of belief, this is something God can directly influence and something the atheists have picked up on. Many atheists are clear that if God wanted them to believe in Him or in the miraculous, he could simply “show up in power” and win people over. The apologist’s retort (which I used to offer) that people would still not believe is a stretch and definitely unbiblical. Many of Jesus signs were designed to evoke faith, the first followers were convinced Messianic followers because they saw the risen Lord. Faith comes from hearing and seeing God in action not from an effort of the imaginative will.
I would argue that the fact that God does not write “Jesus is Lord” in the clouds every morning, or send fire from heaven down on atheist conferences is good evidence that God’s primary focus and requirement is not on evoking belief unto salvation. We know that God wants everyone saved (1 Tim 2) but if unbelief stood in the way then God would be doing everything possible to combat unbelief. He would be equipping his Church to do miracles in order to convince unbelievers. But this is clearly not happening so it can’t be His strategy
What then, are we to conclude, with the Calvinists, that God does not intend everyone to be saved? No, we are to conclude that faith (i.e. belief) is not the condition for salvation but the evidence of salvation. When Paul says “if you believe in your heart that God raised him [Jesus] from the dead you will be saved” (Rom 10:9) he is not telling unbelievers what to do in order to be saved, but assuring believers (Romans is written to believers) that their belief is evidence of their future salvation. Belief provides assurance. Unbelievers, though they will ultimately be saved and brought under God’s reign in Jesus (Eph 1:10) are simply unaware of it.
This approach to belief and salvation is to be commended for the peace it offers believers. Who but an egoist can experience the peace of Jesus if they think those around them are destined for destruction? Who can rejoice that they are saved but that their family is not? But the peace that comes from knowing that God is the saviour of all, and that, as believers, we are privy to this plan, conquers all fear that we are not able to convert our neighbours. When we read that God’s salvation is for all who believe (Rom 1:16) we are misreading the text: God’s salvation is revealed to all who believe but it is for everyone (i.e. Jews and Greeks i.e non-Jews). God is the God of all, he is the Saviour of all, the Gospel is Good News for all!
And so evangelical preachers should switch from “have more faith” to “be more faithful” if they are to really expand the Gospel. Not only is “believe harder” preaching to the choir, it does not advance the Gospel. But if pastors would take courage to preach faithfulness in action, loving obedience and service, the reign of God would visibly extend and increase in power. When this happens, people will look on and believe the Gospel that Jesus is In Charge, that he Is Boss, that Jesus is Lord

Nazarene's embrace Rome at their General Assembly

This is the report my firend and brother Manny Silva wrote on what we saw at the Nazarene GA. I will follow to fill in some information because I am an ex Catholic.
Mannys report....

Attended A Workshop: Scripture As Spiritual Formation. It was led by Mark Maddix of Northwest Nazarene University and Richard Thompson.




Shortly after it started, I think we knew where it was going. Professor Maddix later promoted lectio divina, one of the contemplative spirituality rituals. He later ended the session by encouraging people to investigate more into learning about spiritual formation. At the end, I was the last person to ask a question, and I asked Mr. Maddix:



“My father was rescued from the bondage of the Roman Catholic church years ago as a young man, and became a Christian. He preached for years as a Nazarene pastor until he died. So why is it that the Nazarene denomination is welcoming and promoting mystical practices that come straight out of Roman Catholicism, which is a false religion?”



Mark Maddix strongly disagreed with me. Mr. Maddix unequivocally stated that the Roman Catholics are our brothers and sisters in Christ. He does not believe it is a false religion, even though it is clear that the RCC preaches works-based salvation. Mr. Maddix does not know what he is talking about regarding the history of the Roman Catholic Church. He made an erroneous claim that we got the Bible from the RCC, which is dead wrong.



A man then came up to me- and said he was grieved at my comments and my “attack” against Roman Catholics, because he has many friends who are Catholic. I said so did I, and what does that have to do with telling the truth that it is a false religion. I asked if he would be willing to show me through Scripture that I was wrong, but he walked away. I sensed much disapproval after I asked my question, and when Bev Turner followed up with pointing out the teachings that are being promoted in the universities, a man across the room yelled at here disrespectfully, asking if she had read those books. She responded yes, I did. Telling the truth to these people touches a real never with them, but I thanked the Lord I had the chance to witness to the truth. A young lady approached me after and thanked me for stating something and this issue, which was troubling her also. It made it all worth it.



If we can reach one person in these sessions by voicing our biblical objection to what is going on, then I give praise to God for obediently following His command to “bring light into the darkness.” I firmly believe that Mark Maddix, and a whole lot of other leadership in the church, have bought into these lies and have been deceived. I believe if the question was asked of some of our General Superintendents, they might be forced to admit the same belief Mark Maddix expressed.



The church is embracing the rituals and beliefs of a false religion. It is embracing a religion that actually teaches that we ourselves are lost, unless we come back to the “mother church!” We are told in Scripture to come out, to be separate, not to join them. As I think of my dad, and how he returned to preach to the very people who were lost as Roman Catholics, I continue to think how ironic that this has turned around this way. It was a sad moment I experienced as I attended my first workshop at GA.
End of Mannys report my comments to follow.

We were all in this with Manny and I took more of an observe stance to see how they would respond to Manny.
Manny and myself continued to question Mark Maddix as we left the room. I had Marks ear for a second you could tell both guys were upset so I was gentle. I straight up asked Mark if he thought that Catholics taught the same gospel as the Protestants taught and Bible believing Christians taught.
Mark said yes both taught the same gospel of grace.

Mark is in great error here. If the gospels were the same there never would have been a split during the reformation. For sure Mark does not know what the Catholic church teaches but I also question if Mark understands the true gospel at all. Im not sure because of his answers.
The Catholic church teaches that you receive grace through the 7 sacraments so Mark is just flat out in error. The Roman Catholic church teaches that everyone else is in error but them so even though they may call us brothers and sisters in the Lord the actual church (not individual Catholics) would not recognize us as such.
The gospel according  to Rome is one of Jesus's death on the Cross, plus our works, plus grace given through the 7 official sacraments of the Holy Mother Church. And that probably will not get you straight to heaven but you end up with a certain amount of time out in Purgatory.
As for Rome giving us the Bible that's again college professors rewriting history.
Here is a good article explaining that..
http://carm.org/did-roman-catholic-church-give-us-our-bible

Another good article to read

http://www.biblebelievers.com/SHooper1.html


So I guess the point is the Church of the Nazarene has professors that actually do not know the history of the Catholic church or its teachings by the Magesterium (not individual Catholic because it does not matter what they think but what the Holy Mother Church teaches through the Magesterium and its heirarchy.
Nazarene professors rewriting history. No news flash there

Beware of those advertising great endtime Revivals and Awakenings

Beware of those promoting a new Great Awakening or great Revival because of what scripture teaches in the end times.


Most, if not all of the preachers and evangelists (many call themselves prophets and apostles) agree that the time is short - the end is near. Among Christians in general, there is a great feeling of urgency to go about the task that has been set before the Church...to preach the gospel to all the nations. There is also general agreement that the Church has been, and to a degree, is still lazy, content to sit in their pews, pay their tithes, and bask in the reflected glory of their own little ponds. Most of the churches spend more time arguing with each other over jots and tittles than in going about their real job - reaching a lost and dying world with the gospel of Jesus Christ.

While all Christians want to see a move of God, and conversions by the thousands (or even millions), we must examine several things in the light of The Word of God, and also in the light of published (written and spoken) statements made by those who are advertising this great revival and move of God. Links to other sites will be obvious by their blue color, so that you may go and read for yourself those things that are said that have a bearing on these questions. First and foremost is a small admonition that will weave a thread throughout this study. We, as Christians, live by faith...NOT by sight. Beyond that, I believe that most of us can agree-we are in the end times, spoken of in The Word, and it won't be very long before we see the rise of the anti-christ and his false prophet. But what does The Word say about these times? Is there going to be a great worldwide revival? What about the ''move of the spirit'' as typified in the Toronto Blessing/Vineyard and Brownsville Revival movement, and its attendant functionaries and proponents, such as Steve Hill, Benny Hinn, Rod Parsley, Paul Crouch, Kenneth Copeland, et al? What about the moral fiber of these alleged prophets of God? This question comes into play simply because of the influence these people have over thousands of believers throughout the world, and the millions of dollars being given to them to support their ministries so as to create this world wide revival.

This brings us to the question of: If there is no end time revival (or move of God) then how do we explain all the manifestations that are occurring in various places, and the appearance of revival that is occurring. How do we explain all the thousands upon thousands in other places that are coming to God during the crusades.

First, I believe that we need to examine very carefully the "manifestations" that are occurring in places like the Toronto Vineyard (now the Airport ??????), or at Brownsville AoG, or in the crusades that Benny Hinn puts on. The links appearing here will go into far more detail, and are from eyewitnesses. Aside from that, I can attest to having seen, on tape and on tv some of the manifestations spoken of. I find, in scripture, no corresponding description to what I have observed other than in Mark 1:23-26, where Jesus cast a demon out of a man in the synagogue, and after the "spirit had torn him", it departed. Try as I might, I can find no place, in Old Testament or New, where there are examples of people shaking violently, twitching uncontrollably, flopping on the floor like fish out of water, or laughing for hours on end in a manner more devilish than truly happy. I must admit to having the hair on my neck stand up when I observed many of these things, and failing at any time to receive a witness of the Holy Spirit that these things were from God. I do not doubt that the things, in most cases, were real, but the real question is from what spirit they came. In over 20 years of ministry, I have NEVER seen a manifestation of one of the gifts of the Holy Spirit that did not, unequivocally, point to Jesus Christ, and glorify God in the doing of it. The Holy Spirit does not bring attention to Himself or to the person being used, but ONLY to Jesus Christ. As Jesus said "Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth is come, he will guide you into all truth; for HE SHALL NOT SPEAK OF HIMSELF; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. He shall GLORIFY ME..." John 16:13-14. Many times during ministry, I have seen or heard things that the Holy Spirit did not bear witness with, and can be best explained as the flesh trying to simulate spiritual things, but these things I have observed on TBN, and via Brownsville tapes bear the imprint of the devil himself, not the Spirit of God.

Of great importance here is a question concerning the moral character of the people purporting to be instruments and ministers of God. Paul, in I Timothy gives a reasonable explanation of the type of character that must be possessed by a man of God, When talking about bishops, or deacons (translate pastors, shepherds, elders, or those in positions of spiritual leadership), two points become quickly obvious. One, that the person must have a good report of them which are without, and two, that they be not doubletongued, or greedy of money, and must HOLD THE MYSTERY OF THE FAITH IN PURE CONSCIENCE. My understanding of these passages are that a minister of God cannot do things in such a way as to cause those who do not know God (those who are without) to question him, or to bring reproach upon the name of God.

The second thing that a minister of God cannot be is doubletongued (lying, fibbing, exaggerating, stretching, or wishy-washy depending upon who he is talking to). I would submit that many of the ministers we have today such as Benny Hinn, Paul Crouch, Steve Hill and others fail miserably in the question of being doubletongued. Aside from outright lies that they have been caught in, none of them seem to believe that the scripture is profitable for reproof, and reject any and all admonition from others concerning their heretical statements. Paul Crouch in particular has vocally cursed any who would dare to point out anything to him that does not meet with his own belief. When ministers of God presume to place themselves above the Word of God, and immune from what it says, or think to change what the Word says into something they want it to say, then they have gone beyond the point of just being in error, and fall squarely into the definition of ''ungodly men who have crept in''(Jude). ''Clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots...to who is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever''.



Rodney Howard Browne started this off around 1987 when he stated “In 1987 when the Lord opened the door for us to come to the USA. He told us to stir up the churches, to get them on fire for God, so they would be stirred to win the lost.

Out of this came The Toronto Blessing, Pensacola Blessing, Lakeland with Todd Bentley and many other venues featuring bizarre manifestations that includes slain in the spirit, people acting like animals and many other weird manifestations not found in the scriptures.

Bill Johnson, Rick Joyner and many others also advertise their meeting as Great Awakenings.

Dan Bohi advertises his revivals as Great Awakenings as well. Here is what Dan’s stated mission is…

“A calling to awaken the church of Jesus Christ

to the power, purity, and freedom of the Spirit-Filled life,

found, realized, experienced and exhibited

in the lives of believers in the Book of Acts.”

It all sounds good doesn’t it?

What Christian does not want revival which would cause us to turn from all the false teachings that is rampant in the church today.

But wait the above listed are all false teachers so if a great Awakening or Great Revival would cause us to wake up, read scripture and then as a result not just live sanctified lives but turn from false teaching.

We would have to turn from all the above teachers if what they claim is happening.

But wait lets hold on the brakes and see what scripture teaches on this matter.

Does the Word of God tell us of an end-times world-wide or ''great" revival?

The closest we can come to a clear statement of what the end times shall be like is found in Jesus' words to His disciples in Matthew 24, sometimes referred to as the Olivet Discourse. The disciples came to Jesus, and asked:

vs.3: Tell us, when shall these thing be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

vs.4: And Jesus answered and said unto them, take heed that no man deceive you.

vs.5: for many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.

vs.6: and ye shall hear of wars and rumors of wars; see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.

vs.7: For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.

vs.8: All these are the beginning of sorrows.

vs9: Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.

vs.10: and then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.

vs.11: and many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.

vs.12: and because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.

vs.13: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

vs.14: and this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations, and then shall the end come.

vs.38: for as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark...

There are a number of points made in this discourse, and we will examine them one by one.

Vs.4-take heed that no man deceive you. Jesus was making clear that there would be people who would attempt, in any number of ways, to deceive the believer. By what means He did not expound upon, other than to say...

Vs.5-many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ. The construction of this sentence leaves the possibility that not only would some come saying that they were the christ (Mayatreya is a recent example), but of more importance, since Jesus was talking to His disciples (true believers), that many would come, simply, in His name, meaning that they were professing Christians supposedly ministering in the name of Jesus. That such people can exist is borne out in many books throughout the New Testament, such as Timothy, Peter, James, John, and Jude. Of interesting note here is a statement made, and supported by others, by Kenneth Copeland, about being ''a little Christ walking around up here''.

Vs.11- and many false prophets shall arise, and shall deceive many. Many Christians tend to rely upon an oft quoted section of the Old Testament concerning false prophets, in which God says that we shall know a false prophet if what he says does not come to pass. Assumption: if something DOES come to pass, then the prophet must be righteous. What is often skipped is the little squib in Deuteronomy 13:1-3, where God says if there arise among you a prophet, or a dreamer of dreams, and giveth thee a SIGN or a WONDER, and the sign or the wonder COME TO PASS...thou shalt not hearken unto the words of that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams: for the LORD your God proveth you, to know whether ye love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul. Puts us in a bind as to who to believe, doesn't it? No. All we have to do is check out what the person is saying, and weigh it against the Word of God. If it doesn't line up, then they don't, and are to be ignored. Many today use scripture to support or destroy certain beliefs or points that they are trying to make, but we are admonished to use all scripture, which is given by God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness (2Tim3:16). The part concerning reproof and correction will come into serious play a little later.

Vs.14 - and this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations... I think it is very important to note that Jesus said this gospel...shall be PREACHED (or published)...for a witness. Nowhere did Jesus say that the gospel shall be believed, or acted upon, or cause millions of conversions...only that it would be preached as a witness. The sinner cannot know he is a sinner unless the gospel of righteousness is preached to him, nor can he repent unless he knows..and how shall they know, if there is no preacher? Still, the point is that although we may use many different means (including this web presentation) to preach the gospel, there is no guarantee from scripture or otherwise that it will be believed and acted upon. Indeed, scripture in Matt.24:9-10 makes very clear that true gospel preachers and true believers will be hated, and afflicted, and even killed.

Vs.38-as it was in the days of Noah... I will have to admit here to a great deal of speculation concerning just exactly what it was like then. The Bible tells us only that God told Noah to build an ark because He was disgusted with the actions of mankind, and He was going to destroy them. Obviously, Noah was chosen because he conducted himself in a manner that was pleasing to God, and did not do those things that the rest of mankind was doing. The real speculation enters here. I think it is reasonable to assume that while Noah was gathering materials, and building what was a VERY large boat (ship?), some of the townsfolk had to be curious. I am sure that at some point, these people asked Noah what he was doing. Noah, upon explaining that he was building an ark, was then asked why? ''So that I can ride out the flood''. What is a flood? ''A whole lot of water''. Since there had not been rain on the earth up til this time, I doubt the people understood, and if Noah also said (I'm sure he did) that God had told him to do it, these worldly people had to have made a lot of fun of Noah. That happens to be a lot like today. People of the world are complete in their own eyes, and make fun of the things of God, even to the point of trying to stop Christians (particularly) and just about any other religious types from doing or saying anything that might ''offend'' them. Indeed, many are offended because of Christ.

All of this leads us to the point where we may reasonably say that the end times will be characterized by a number of things:

1. Increasing denial of God by the world.

2. Increasing ungodliness in activity.

3. Increasing demand by religious people for hearing & experiencing only what they want.

4. Increasing apostasia from sound doctrine and truth.

Rather than a ''great revival'', what we will see (and are currently seeing) is the apostasy of those claiming to be Christian, a great falling away from the truth of Jesus Christ and the written Word of God.

So again beware of those who go out and proclaim that they will bring a great Awakening to the church in these endtimes we are in.

Why because I say so?

No because the scriptures do not teach it.



Other sources John 8:12.com

And the various other false teachers listed websites and FB pages